Mentors and Intra Day Traders

[sigmund1]

Mentors and Day Traders

Everyone has the right to waste their money anyway they see fit.

But really how dumb is dumb.

Years of solid scientific unbiased evidence clearly shows that Day Trading is a losers game.

Most go bust sooner, in the end all go bust.

Don't take my word for it, this information is free on the internet.

So how come multitudes of mug gamblers still don't get the message.

Keep in mind your friendly day trading Mentor asking £1000 for a crash day trading course is in all probabilities a Failed Day Trading Gambler Holic.

Not interested in wealth creation but rather topping up their gambling account for that instant adrenalin rush that feels soooo goood.

As our Nan say's, society wouldn't function without fools and nor would the markets.

 

[wallstreetwarrior87]

Everyone has the right to waste their money anyway they see fit.

But really how dumb is dumb.

Years of solid scientific unbiased evidence clearly shows that Intra Day Trading is a losers game.

Most go bust sooner, in the end all go bust.

Don't take my word for it, this information is free on the internet.

So how come multitudes of mug gamblers still don't get the message.

Keep in mind your friendly day trading Mentor asking £1000 for a crash day trading course is in all probabilities a Failed Day Trading Gambler Holic.

Not interested in wealth creation but rather topping up their gambling account for that instant adrenalin rush that feels soooo goood.

As our Nan say's, society wouldn't function without fools and nor would the markets.

Yes your are correct that this is a tough business, but remember this is like anything in life, everyone can't win.

I have underlined the key area I personally think is vital - studies are carried out based on a foundation of "random probability". When this is the case how can science ever know what they are supposed to be studying? There for how can any results provide anything other than a confirmation that you don't know what you don't know?

To have meaning we need to take out random , but without knowledge how can this be done? It cant - hence the results of studies just confirm that Joe blogs throws his darts with a blindfold on!

 

[sigmund1]

Found One

Crickey, I just spoke to this guy on the phone, he's a mentor and what a nice chap too!

Tells me he's been into the markets for around 17 years.

Traded just about everything and is willing to show me what he's learnt for the extrodinary and reasonable price of £1100.

I get a few solid hours instruction and he'll even travel to met me.

Blimey, sounds like my lucky day.

He even supports my favorite football team.

He tells me that he'll teach me about...

Entry rules.
Exit rules.
Chart Patterns.
Money Management.
Position Sizing.
Financial Psychology.

Don't know about you but I can't wait to met him, might even go for a beer later on!

OK, OK, just hold a minute, back to the real world.

Entry rules, chart patterns, money management etc, etc, etc.

You can get all that information on the internet for FREE.

For a few quid you can even buy the books and for a few shillings you can buy them used.

So why would anyone hand over £1000's for information that is literally free.

And what are you going to do with this information...shake off the Yoke of Servitude.

Ho, Ho, Ho.

There's one born every second.

 

[sigmund1]

What Now

OK, so you did the crash day trading course with your friendly Mentor and what a nice chap he was too!

So your now armed with your arsenal of trading weapons. Markets Look Out.

But hang on....So is everyone else!

Everyone has exactly the same stuff to trade with that you do.

The bad news is 80% of traders go bust within the first 12 months.

The rest a little later.

But don't take my word for it.

The research papers are on the internet and they're free.

 

[sigmund1]

Smell the Coffee Time

NEW YORK (CNNfn) - Day traders stand a better chance of winning a coin toss than striking it rich on Wall Street, according to a study released by a national securities group.

In a scathing report, the National American Securities Administrators Association, said most day traders actually lose money, and even those that manage to beat the odds don't make as much money as they thought they would.

"Day trading isn't investing, it's at best speculating," said David Shellenberger, chief of licensing at the Massachusetts Securities Division, chair of the task force and the report's primary author. "Most traders will lose all of their money."

Day trading is an increasingly popular investment practice whereby customers utilize quick-in, quick-out trading practices hoping to benefit from short-term volatility in selected stocks. The practice is especially popular among Internet shares, which will often fluctuate dramatically in a given day.

Riches to rags?

NASAA's survey found the industry is harboring countless tales of monetary losses that far outweigh profitable tales.

An analysis of trading patterns at one day-trading firm in the study showed 7 out of 10 day traders lose money, while fewer than 12 percent made a profit on their short-term trades.

NASAA also claimed a majority of day trading firms rebuffed requests from state regulators to back up claims of profitability. In one instance, the association claims regulators found 67 of the 68 accounts at a day trading branch in Massachusetts lost money.

The report charged some firms -- to hold onto customers and the commissions they generate - encouraged customers to lend each other money to meet margin calls when the stocks they bought went south.
****

 

[tomorton]

Years of solid scientific unbiased evidence clearly shows that Day Trading is a losers game.

Most go bust sooner, in the end all go bust.

Don't take my word for it, this information is free on the internet.

I agree day-trading is a fast route to ruin for nearly every new trader. However, I actually, I don't see much research evidence to support this. The research that is usually cited is old, US-based and commercially biased.

I don't argue with the conclusion - I have posted more than once on here and elsewhere that new traders should not start with day-trading - but it would be nice to see some solid information other than my own personal conclusions.

 

[sigmund1]

Idiot's Welcome

Sounds like a death wish, a finacial death wish.

Day Trading that is!

I just read Terrance Odeon and Brad Barber's research paper into day traders.

80,000 day traders over a 10 year period.

In their research paper I see things like...

8 out of 10 day traders lose money.
Losing Day Traders should curtian their day trading activity.
Most Day Traders, especially heavy day traders lose money.
Such repeated gambles do not tend to produce highly skewed profits.
Most day traders are Overconfident in their own success.
Stories circulate that day trading is more profitable that it actually is.
Individual day traders may believe themselves more likely to succeed than the average day trader.
Day Traders hold unrealistic beliefs about the chances of success.
Our analysis of performance indicates that day trading is Treacherous.
These results paint a dim portrait of day traders.
Of the 2 out of 10 who do make a profit, it is not consistent profit.

Good Bloody Grief, is it me or are day traders mad between the ears!

And there's another thing...the 2 out of 10 that are profitable still fail when compared to a simple dumb Buy and Hold.

Gotta Go...Nans just text..."brewing up, Hacienda La Esmaralda coffee, pop around"

 

[sigmund1]

Dumbest Job Ever

Don't know about you but this gave me a laugh, if only a little one!

In an article from Business Insider.

The Title...The Dumbest Job Ever, Day Trading.

continues...

A sure-fire way to do Worse than an Index Fund.

Will do worse than Index funds even though they'll spending all day trading.

Day trading is hazardous to your wealth.

Far from being an enriching line of work, 4 out of 5 day traders PAY to do it.

The folks who predictably make money from day trading, of course, are the folks who sell traders tools for their day trading: Information courses, "how-to" advice, data streams, stock charts, technical analysis, trading clubs, investment advice, stock picks, you name it.* Those folks do quite well from day-trading.* Unless they're dumb enough to actually day trade.

But what about the 1% who do make money from Day Trading... On an hourly basis a kid flipping burgers make more money.

Our Nan say's...horrible smelly little people with a cigarette in one hand and a cup of cheap coffee in the other...they get what they deserve!

 

[petetrades]

Don't know about you but this gave me a laugh, if only a little one!

In an article from Business Insider.

The Title...The Dumbest Job Ever, Day Trading.

continues...

A sure-fire way to do Worse than an Index Fund.

Will do worse than Index funds even though they'll spending all day trading.

Day trading is hazardous to your wealth.

Far from being an enriching line of work, 4 out of 5 day traders PAY to do it.

The folks who predictably make money from day trading, of course, are the folks who sell traders tools for their day trading: Information courses, "how-to" advice, data streams, stock charts, technical analysis, trading clubs, investment advice, stock picks, you name it.* Those folks do quite well from day-trading.* Unless they're dumb enough to actually day trade.

But what about the 1% who do make money from Day Trading... On an hourly basis a kid flipping burgers make more money.

Our Nan say's...horrible smelly little people with a cigarette in one hand and a cup of cheap coffee in the other...they get what they deserve!

Atleast here in USA traders pay a higher tax rate than the general workforce, so you could make an argument that it's good for big government to have for-profit charlatans herd these sheep into this dumb line of "work".

 

[sigmund1]

Greg Secker, Super Mentor, Maybe!

I tripped over the name of Greg Secker.

He's supposed to be some kind of super mentor.

I did a few clicks of the mousey Goggle thingy and found myself falling down the proverbial Rat Hole.

In the blink of an eye I found that Mr Secker has been investigated by the BBC, the Guardian news paper, the Scam Alert web site and some guy who wrote up his experiences on a Spread Betting web site after attending one of his seminars.

There might be more but to be honest I do have a life and there was a rather attractive young lady waiting for my attentions at the time, so as you can imagine, it was a no-brainer that I shut down the computer right quick.

My take on the write ups, if you want to be bombarded with Time Share like sale pitches, please go along.

As for turning out profitable traders, I just couldn't find anything like that no matter where I looked.

 

[sigmund1]

message for Ms Sally Nicoll

I'm confused, really confused.

I actually found a positive endorsement for Greg Secker, no kidding.

Bet's and the City by Sally Nicoll, circa 2004.

Sally did his course and in her book claims to be a winning trader.

Not so fast, let me be clear on this...she made around 15 trades which ended in an overall profit.

15 trades don't make a summer or a millionaire trader, but it's a positive start.

So by my reckoning, a dozen or so years later from when Sally wrote this she should be a millionaire trader by now!

Never mind about "Common Eileen" how about "Common Sally"!

 

[petetrades]

I agree day-trading is a fast route to ruin for nearly every new trader. However, I actually, I don't see much research evidence to support this. The research that is usually cited is old, US-based and commercially biased.

I don't argue with the conclusion - I have posted more than once on here and elsewhere that new traders should not start with day-trading - but it would be nice to see some solid information other than my own personal conclusions.

Day trading is a fast route to ruin for any trader period. Show me a veteran trader who is makin g a good income with limited risk and limited stress. It's the #1 fallacy of trading marketers that trading skills improve over time.

 

[sigmund1]

This is amusing...I found a Greg Secker, south African web site.

On it was lots of endorsements, but what was really funny was that everyone bar one was signed ANANYMOUS.

The one that wasn't just said he found the seminar interesting.

REALLY, GREG, COME-ON.

Another site Greg claims to have trained 700,000 clients.

WOW that's impressive.

But as much as try Googling, I just can't find anyone who states they have made that elusive one million.

By the way, on my travels in cyber-land, I did find Greg's name mentioned on some other web sites.

Just in case your interested...

RIP-OFF'S. Australian web site.
TRADE2WIN chat group....not me.
RIP-OFF REPORT.

All in all, nothing good and a lot, well, how would you describe it!

 

[sigmund1]

Sandy Jadeja, Market Timer.

I love market timers, they make me feel so superior!

That's because they just keep getting it wrong all the time.

Look at Sandy Jadeja, he likes the Time Cycles.

And not just Any Time Cycle, But Gann Time Cycles.

I found his name in Sally Nicols book under mentors.

I couldn't help but notice that even after Sally met Sandy she still kept on losing.

So much for timing!

So what happend to Sandy's Great Gann Time Cycles of 2016?

I found an article in Business Insider, June 2016.

Sandy was a worried man back then, really worried.

Seems the markets were approaching impending danger, well. at least in Sandy's mind they were...ho,ho,ho.

The Great Gann Grand Time Cycle from the Great Depression 1929 was about to re-visit.

Hells Bells. Double Poo-Sticks.

The World According to Sandy Jajeda...

"End of August to End of October" was Armageddon Time.

Prices were going to drop 800-1200 points on the Dow.

But what really happened...

From August to October there was a normal and shallow correction of some miniscule percentage.

And then in the first week of November price took off like a rocket ship to Mars.

Was Sandy short the market at this time, oh rolloxs, I hope not, he would have had his head handed to himself on a plate.

Don't forget those Stops Sandy.

Our Nan, who's a financial genius say's...

They couldn't time a boiled egg let alone the markets.

 

[sigmund1]

Mentors, Consultants.

You can guarantee one thing, when someone is looking for advice they will find a swarm of people willing to sell it to them.

Mentors and consultants fall into this swarmy bracket.

Those advisors who play to this expectation will get rich.

This year it might be Forex.

Or it might be Options.

Or it might be Gold.

Inevitably there is one result from this parade of promises...

When the person with the money meets the person with the experience, the person with the experience ends up with the money and the person with the money leaves with the experience.

 

[Lúidín]

You can guarantee one thing, when someone is looking for advice they will find a swarm of people willing to sell it to them.

Mentors and consultants fall into this swarmy bracket.

Those advisors who play to this expectation will get rich.

This year it might be Forex.

Or it might be Options.

Or it might be Gold.

Inevitably there is one result from this parade of promises...

When the person with the money meets the person with the experience, the person with the experience ends up with the money and the person with the money leaves with the experience.

You are right..and you are wrong!

Of course mentors will take your money..after all..that is their "business model". If one is silly enough to hand over their money..well..they really deserve what they get.

Now the wrong bit.

Daytraders lose because of one simple fact..that being..they do not know what they are doing. Any job, trade, profession..requires years of experience (good and bad) to become the best at what you do..be it hanging a door..wiring a fuseboard..plastering a ceiling..selling cars..insurance policies..managing people..managing accounts..etc..etc..etc.

The big problem with daytrading is that the information out there is not the best information that allows one to shorten the learning curve. If an apprentice trains with a top notch qualified tradesman, then the chances are the apprentice will turn out to be a top notch tradesman also..unless he is as thick as a plank of course..in which case he will never be good at doing anything.

So..if one is really adamant about shortening the learning curve..then one has to make it one's business to find the best tradesman to train one..and this is not easy..as the majority are clueless about what is really required to make money daytrading..and it is the exact opposite of what most think it is!

Btw..I am a vendor as you can see..but I have never taken a penny from any person who has ever asked me anything about trading..nor will I ever do so.

Here is a tip for those who must seek out the best of the best..if He or She does not insist on showing you all about losing trades first..then He or She is more than likely in the top 99% of mentors out there.

Most are clueless when it comes to daytrading..and they show how silly and ridiculous they really are the minute they open their mouths.

 

[wackypete2]

Most are clueless when it comes to daytrading..and they show how silly and ridiculous they really are the minute they open their mouths.

Agreed, 100%

Peter

 

[Lúidín]

Agreed, 100%

Peter

What amuses me now..as it did not always amuse me during my silly and ridiculous days..is how people think that they can just wake up some day and start making money trading.

Without going into all the usual chit chat about trading..the main problem is that most jump in without thinking it thru clearly and doing some basic research into the financial markets and how they now operate compared to how they used to operate (up to the beginning of the 1980's).

In a nutshell..as the big fat commissions dwindled away due to major changes in taxation and regulation..the money hungry bunch had to invent new ways to get people to part with their money..hello to the explosion of derivatives and "cheap" commissions with online brokers. The days of the elite clubs were truly a thing of the past..and now we had a new bunch of slick city boys and girls dreaming up many new products to satisfy the ever growing search for "easy money".

Once you know what you are up against..and why..it becomes a lot easier to face and deal with the realities of everyday trading..and coming to terms with silly and ridiculous things that happen..which of course are to be expected due to all the new "highly sophisticated" financial products.

I am happy to say that I now know very little about trading..but it took me many years to really understand that knowing I know nothing is much better for my wallet than thinking I know a good bit.

Funny really..it is the one area where knowing nothing is really to your advantage..but how many people out there want to know nothing!

 

[sigmund1]

What do Mentors Do?

Mentors will teach you how to trade!

But they can't teach you how to be PROFITABLE.

 

[Lúidín]

Mentors will teach you how to trade!

But they can't teach you how to be PROFITABLE.

This reminds me of a post I came across on this site in the past..the poster was saying that he paid a certain person on this site over 1,000 pounds for a course on daytrading US stocks..but..even though he has not made any money from the methods he was shown..it was not the mentors fault

how silly can people be..imagine that person could not even see how ridiculous his statement was..of course it is the mentors fault..as..it is the mentors job to make sure that you understand what it is you need to do..and more importantly..show you how to go about turning words into actions..and actions into profits

a bad teacher is one who can not show the student the best and correct way to learn what is required..and who fails to recognize why the student is not progressing

most are clueless when it comes to making money trading..hence that is why they are bad teachers