Losing it all! (loosing)

the naivety of some clowns on this forum is hilarious.

so people never over invest or have **** risk parameters etc etc? because humans are robots and never screw up?

majority of successful traders will have had numerous blow ups. its almost a pre requisite. and im not just saying that because i did, this was also told to me just this week by a rather successful trader.
 
@ New Trader
Instead of more passive aggressive bull5hit why don't you elaborate on your own blow-up by telling us about some of the risk measures you were using?

@ Rothschild
Hedge funds' purpose is to take excessive risk to generate a high beta. That's why they blow up. Would you expect a pension fund to blow up? Most people on these boards aren't hedge funds they're day/medium term traders and should have different risk parameters.
When you say people screw up what exactly do you mean?
 
DionysusToast said:
I don't take the sort of risks that would make it possible.

If I even had a 10% drawdown, I'd stop trading and re-assess.
Click to expand...

So if you have a 10% drawdown, 50 losers in a row, whatever.

You re-assess, then you get back to trading, and you continue to lose.

The process repeats, surely it's theoretically possible that you blow up?

Surely there's also a possibility that you don't follow your rules for whatever reason. I've never raped someone, and I highly doubt I ever would, but hell, I can't say 100% that it can't happen.

(I don't know what definition we're using here, for some systems I have losing 20% would be a "blow up").
 
N Rothschild said:
the naivety of some clowns on this forum is hilarious.

so people never over invest or have **** risk parameters etc etc? because humans are robots and never screw up?

majority of successful traders will have had numerous blow ups. its almost a pre requisite. and im not just saying that because i did, this was also told to me just this week by a rather successful trader.
Click to expand...

You want to place yourself in a group of successful people, this is understandable.

Of course, some people have tried, failed, dusted themselves off and become successful.

Many, many more traders have tried, failed and eventually given up, run out of money or run out of spousal patience.

Which group you will eventually be in remains to be seen. It is largely irrelevant whether any individual trader has blown up and consequently made it.

You blow up through excessive risk, which you may or may not have been aware of.

It's not a particularly smart thing to do. People that do it claim to have learnt their lesson. Usually the lesson is - "don't go all in". It's all down to risk appetite & greed.

I'll admit to being a plodder when it comes to trading. I do not aspire to becoming the next George Soros.
 
Hotch said:
So if you have a 10% drawdown, 50 losers in a row, whatever.

You re-assess, then you get back to trading, and you continue to lose.

The process repeats, surely it's theoretically possible that you blow up?

Surely there's also a possibility that you don't follow your rules for whatever reason. I've never raped someone, and I highly doubt I ever would, but hell, I can't say 100% that it can't happen.

(I don't know what definition we're using here, for some systems I have losing 20% would be a "blow up").
Click to expand...

I don't use systems, so I wouldn't go through a protracted losing streak with the hope that the system would start making money again. I'm mostly a discretionary trader. The markets do change but from my time with them I have managed to adapt to the changes, a result of watching the market most days and changing with it.

I started off barely risking anything when I traded. Should I have a big draw, then I will go back to barely risking anything and only size up if I got my confidence back.
 
scose-no-doubt said:
@ New Trader
Instead of more passive aggressive bull5hit why don't you elaborate on your own blow-up by telling us about some of the risk measures you were using?
Click to expand...

1) I traded a mechanical system to start with and that required a number of account top ups until I finally gave up and realised that mechanical trading is bullsh!t.

2) When I abandoned mechanical trading in the early days I made mistakes that even Jesse Livermore made when he knew better. Why? Because as he states, we are human. It's easy to say things like 'never move your stop'...but, unfortunately, I convinced myself I was right and I moved my stop to give the market 'breathing' room. My stop was hit, but that didn't deter me, I was still convinced I was right and wanted to recover my losses...so I re-entered...I did this 3 or 4 times and...margin call. It took a few months to top up my account again.

I studied and practised in the mean time and thought that I had ironed out my 'bugs' and believed I had an even better understanding of the market than I did before and that was a mistake because now I was trading with more bravado and once again that led to a margin call for the reason stated above.

This is why I tell people that they must keep their stops tight and never, under any circumstances move them. It is THE only way you will last long enough to become proficient at picking winning moves.
 
So then you admit your risk parameters were sh*t i.e. relied on your ability to deal with your emotions and you have now developed your psychological make up to make your risk parameters effective. How then, is my post #20 statement a platitude?

I swear the people on this site could argue with a shadow over it's shade of black.
 
scose-no-doubt said:
So then you admit your risk parameters were sh*t i.e. relied on your ability to deal with your emotions and you have now developed your psychological make up to make your risk parameters effective. How then, is my post #20 statement a platitude?

I swear the people on this site could argue with a shadow over it's shade of black.
Click to expand...

What I meant was it's easy just to utter them. Most people read a trading book and rattle off platitudes they've just read, but, as someone once said, in an abnormal situation normal people behave abnormally.
 
Last edited:
I agree. The main reason I stopped trading is my inability to accept losers. Whether that's to do with me being unwilling to accept I was wrong or whether I was trading too high a stake and unable to let go of the money I'm still unsure. When I've built up a big enough pot to have a go I'll find out. :)
 
I would guess the thing about system trading is that you aren't really 'in touch' with the market in the same way a discretionary trader is.

Surely this means that it takes longer to figure out that things aren't going right.

With discretionary trading, the feedback is immediate.
 
new_trader said:
1) I traded a mechanical system to start with and that required a number of account top ups until I finally gave up and realised that mechanical trading is bullsh!t.
Click to expand...

Ummm correction: your mechanical trading is bull****.

I've been using mechanical systems for years, and wouldn't have it any other way.
 
DionysusToast said:
You want to place yourself in a group of successful people, this is understandable.

Of course, some people have tried, failed, dusted themselves off and become successful.

Many, many more traders have tried, failed and eventually given up, run out of money or run out of spousal patience.

Which group you will eventually be in remains to be seen. It is largely irrelevant whether any individual trader has blown up and consequently made it.

You blow up through excessive risk, which you may or may not have been aware of.

It's not a particularly smart thing to do. People that do it claim to have learnt their lesson. Usually the lesson is - "don't go all in". It's all down to risk appetite & greed.

I'll admit to being a plodder when it comes to trading. I do not aspire to becoming the next George Soros.
Click to expand...

of course it was excessive risk. i have 100% tolerance to risk. it does not bother me..which is obviously a very bad trait to have.
 
scose-no-doubt said:
I agree. The main reason I stopped trading is my inability to accept losers. Whether that's to do with me being unwilling to accept I was wrong or whether I was trading too high a stake and unable to let go of the money I'm still unsure. When I've built up a big enough pot to have a go I'll find out. :)
Click to expand...

you dont even trade lol, yet you spout out bs like your the messiah.

i may say alot of outrageous things on here, but i do actually have a couple of feathers in my cap.
 
DionysusToast said:
I don't use systems, so I wouldn't go through a protracted losing streak with the hope that the system would start making money again. I'm mostly a discretionary trader. The markets do change but from my time with them I have managed to adapt to the changes, a result of watching the market most days and changing with it.

I started off barely risking anything when I traded. Should I have a big draw, then I will go back to barely risking anything and only size up if I got my confidence back.
Click to expand...

So there's no reason, you just don't think you will, fair enough.
 
N Rothschild said:
you dont even trade lol, yet you spout out bs like your the messiah.

i may say alot of outrageous things on here, but i do actually have a couple of feathers in my cap.
Click to expand...

Messiah? I've been chatting with a few people on a message board about things I've experienced and studied. If you want to continue to use this place to measure your c*ck (small I'm assuming given the degree of compensatory blabber you put forth) in between blowing up accounts then that's your business. I'm here to learn from people.

You saying I spout BS is rich. You were Mugabe's doctor last week weren't you? And going to LSE for a £60k masters before that?

Actually the only thing you say that has any discernible substance is that you've blown high five/low six figure accounts that your dad or someone boxed off for you.

The feathers in your cap are worth about as much as the sh1tty ones on a chickens ar5e.
 
you clearly cant read can you.

because i wanted to study economics ages ago means i said i was going to do a 60k masters at lse?

i have never denied blowing up. but a) it wasnt a high 5 figure account and b) my daddy had nothing to do with it.

i have debated studying medicine for years, so that means i said i am Mugabe's doctor?

no wonder you dont understand markets if the facts get so badly fudged in your brain.
 
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