Hi...i am a Betfair Trader

[garylester]

Hi all,

I am Betfair Trader from Yorkshire,England and i have joined the forum to see if i can pick up a few tips from other forum traders!

And also make some nice friends too!

But if i could meet some more Betfair Traders that would be great!

 

[gedward3]

Hi all,

I am Betfair Trader from Yorkshire,England and i have joined the forum to see if i can pick up a few tips from other forum traders!

And also make some nice friends too!

But if i could meet some more Betfair Traders that would be great!

You just walked into a Butchers and asked for a hammer.

Try a sports betting site as there are loads out there 🙂

 

[shadowninja]

Betfair Trading and Sports Betting Forum - Powered by vBulletin

There are a lot of similarities between financial trading and sports trading but we prefer to call this investing because it guarantees profit by virtue of sounding like you are intelligent. 😉 It is also important to say that gamblers never win and financial trading is not gambling.












😆

 

[Isabella8688]

Hi all,

I am Betfair Trader from Yorkshire,England and i have joined the forum to see if i can pick up a few tips from other forum traders!

And also make some nice friends too!

But if i could meet some more Betfair Traders that would be great!

Hi guys, Im a newbie. Nice to join this forum.

 

[alan5616]

Hi guys, Im a newbie. Nice to join this forum.

Welcome. I hope you will benefit from being a member of T2W. There are quite a few experienced and savvy people here.

 

[Jane Brown]

Hi guys,

Im Jane brown, 24 years old and still studying. Anyways, I joined in this forum cause, i want to learn about fx. and it seems good traders and experts are here in this forum. yes, im doing my own research , reading some books and watching news on the internet about fx. I hope to gain friends here and learn as well. Hope to hear from you soon. guys! 🙂

 

[rich.oregan]

Gary, I'm a Betfair trader also..

I have to disagree with some of the comments out there, I think they are based from people who haven't much experience betting.

Betting and Financial trading are very very similar..
e.g. Instead of backing and laying in betting ,in trading you buy and sell
In both betting and trading you need,
* a strategy or an 'edge' - a statistically proven method of winning more than you lose consistenly
* staking plan or position sizing plan
* betting you bet on odds, trading you bet on price i.e. in betting you buy value, in trading you buy/sell a price that you believ is value at that moment intime because in the future you believe the price will change in your favour
* betting is mostly fixed returns and trading tends to be variable, but with products like binaries the line is blurring..also in betting you can also 'trade' odds, ie buy them (back) and then sell them (lay) to someone else..
* The psychology in betting and trading, especially short term, is very similar..if you speak to pro-betters who bet in-running ie during sports games whilst game is playing, its just the same kind of emotions, fear/greed etc as day trading..

I'd disagree with shadowninja (unless I misinterrepreted his comment);
I definately don't think any trader should get on his high-horse when judging pro-gamblers. Betting and trading is a game where 95% of player consistently lose money and 5% consistently make money (some people say these figures are more or less, but the point is the same; most people lose money consistently)

I would class a gambler , or MUG, as anyone who consistently loses money, and a real trader as anyone who consistently makes money over a long period of time..

The betting world and trading world are 95% (approx) full of MUGS (gamblers). Just the difference from someone who bets and someone who trades, is the betting people, tend to drink pints, smoke fags and read the Sun.. the trading people tend to read financial time, have degrees..they may look more intelligent, but they are mostly still more mugs by my definition of losing money.

Everyone starts out as a mug, you have to transform yourself 🙂

 

[alan5616]

For me, Betfair trading has been more profitable than spot forex trading. I don't have to deal with unscrupulous, rip-off market makers and spread bettors who make their profit by trading against their clients

 

[rich.oregan]

Hey another supporter for betting🙂

But too be honest, it doesnt matter if a spread betting company is trading 'against you', it wont affect your profit..You imply in your comment that if you win they lose, if you lose they win..I've been told by people working for SB companies that they typically don't hedge clients that lose money, they take on a risk by doing that, but they get to keep the money you would have lost to the market.. this is what can make SB companies money, I've had quoted over a pint by a trader at Worldspreads before they went down, that 80% of new clients have lost their entire steak within 3 months..so this can be good business for the company.

but the market is still the market and isnt affected by that.. the price will move anyhow..and since the market is typically a zero-sum game, you would have lost the money anyway just its gone to the spreadbetting companies hands instead of another random guy the otherside of the world you don't know..
and if you make money then the SB company have no choice but the carry that loss.. if I ran an SB company, Id do exactly the same thing..
The reason why traders lose money spreadbetting, I doubt is the platform at all, it is they dont have a proven edge (yet). They need to get one else they are just gambling.

The only thing that annoys me with SB companies is if the execution is crap and I try to take a price but cant get it.. its a shame Worldspreads went down as I hardly had that problem with them..execution was pretty solid

 

[alan5616]

Hey another supporter for betting🙂

But too be honest, it doesnt matter if a spread betting company is trading 'against you', it wont affect your profit..You imply in your comment that if you win they lose, if you lose they win..I've been told by people working for SB companies that they typically don't hedge clients that lose money, they take on a risk by doing that, but they get to keep the money you would have lost to the market.. this is what can make SB companies money, I've had quoted over a pint by a trader at Worldspreads before they went down, that 80% of new clients have lost their entire steak within 3 months..so this can be good business for the company.

but the market is still the market and isnt affected by that.. the price will move anyhow..and since the market is typically a zero-sum game, you would have lost the money anyway just its gone to the spreadbetting companies hands instead of another random guy the otherside of the world you don't know..
and if you make money then the SB company have no choice but the carry that loss.. if I ran an SB company, Id do exactly the same thing..
The reason why traders lose money spreadbetting, I doubt is the platform at all, it is they dont have a proven edge (yet). They need to get one else they are just gambling.

The only thing that annoys me with SB companies is if the execution is crap and I try to take a price but cant get it.. its a shame Worldspreads went down as I hardly had that problem with them..execution was pretty solid

The execution is crap but, some of the SBs are saints when compared to market makers like Alpari. They have all the tricks in their bag, in order to take their client's money. Amongst the tricks are a plethora of error messages, requotes and "trade context busy" alerts. That's without including the slippage that they hit their micro and classic accounts with.

I've had accounts with just about all of the SBs, over the years, and only had problems with two of them (Finspreads and CMC) but these pale into insignificance compared to Alpari's dubious practices.

 

[rsh01]

I'd disagree with shadowninja (unless I misinterrepreted his comment);
I definately don't think any trader should get on his high-horse when judging pro-gamblers.

I think he was joking.

I like your def of a gambler v trader btw.

If gary wants to meet mainly other sports 'traders' then as someone else mentioned he's prob better off joining the many sports betting forums, though obv there's a section here and there's quite a few ppl who are at least interested, me included. Tbf I have not found any decent sports trading forums so perhaps gary has tried also.

What platform do you use? I have used geekstoy for a shortwhile, but did most of my trading on betangel.

Anyway, welcome.

 

[businessoftheday]

Hi,
I am businessoftheday from UK and now i have join the T2W Forums.

 

[rich.oregan]

Hi RSH (ps welcome businessoftheday!)

Never tried BetAngel.. when speed of execution didn't make much difference, I used the standard web interface.. when speed mattered more, used Geekstoy last year (I notice they charge for it now), recently I'm learning c# and use Betfair API as will code my own bot. Another learning curve ! 🙂

Rightnow, since last week..I'm trialing Betting Assistant (1.1) and doing some observations to see if I can find an edge in a certain market.. annoyingly it has a bug in it and the back and lay prices it quotes are far wider than the Betfair market.. meaning that some of my observations over the last few days are useless now , ah!

Adios!

 

[rsh01]

Hi RSH (ps welcome businessoftheday!)

Never tried BetAngel.. when speed of execution didn't make much difference, I used the standard web interface.. when speed mattered more, used Geekstoy last year (I notice they charge for it now), recently I'm learning c# and use Betfair API as will code my own bot. Another learning curve ! 🙂

Rightnow, since last week..I'm trialing Betting Assistant (1.1) and doing some observations to see if I can find an edge in a certain market.. annoyingly it has a bug in it and the back and lay prices it quotes are far wider than the Betfair market.. meaning that some of my observations over the last few days are useless now , ah!

Adios!

Keep us informed of how betting assistant is, having used betangel first, most others were not as slick. Though the majority of the add ons are crap eg soccer mystic, and they brought out a tennis one also to predict odds at certain score - you can do that yourself more accurately, the market is always right as well.

G/l.

 

[rich.oregan]

I'm going to quit Betting Assistant by end of today probably.. perhaps will consider going back to Geekstoy or have a look at what Gruss can offer.. but mostly I just need to focus on programming now coz I want to get away from manual execution.

Ps does anyone here program bots or even automated trading strategies? Perhaps there is a relevent section in this forum, Ill take a gander

 

[rich.oregan]

Hey Jessica, I think you are right when you say game is changing and scripts/code will need to be updated regularly.

But also, the game is always changing for any market anyway.

Whether its a bot you are programming or just trading manually, your strategies will always need to be improved/adjusted depending on market conditions.

So from this point of view, there is no advantage OR disadvantage to using bots.
However the advantage for me in using a bot, is that I don't have to be the monkey that sits his ass down at the computer all day waiting for a trigger to place a trade 🙂

[although, Ill probably still have my ass sat down writing code!]

 

[MattSmith]

Hi,
I'm Matt, 24 years old and still studying. Anyways, I joined in this community cause, I want to learn about management and it seems good traders and experts are here in this forum. I hope to gain friends here and learn as well. Hope to hear from you soon. guys!

 

[rich.oregan]

Alrite mate, you mean 'trade management' or management of people?
if your just starting out, have a look at these books:

1) Trade Your Way To Financial Freedom by Van Tharp
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Trade-Your-...871X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1349996613&sr=8-1

2) Also 'Market Wizzards' books (either) by Jack S I think his name is

1) is more important that 2) Id say, but 2 is a fun and informative read..

Nice1