Commission of a couple of euros per contract.
Commission of a couple of euros per contract.
What causes it?
14 points over the last couple of weeks? Far too close. What were you trading?
new_trader
Legendary member
- Messages
- 6,770
- Likes
- 1,656
Nothing 'causes' it per se. Slippage is a function of market liquidity which is something spread betting newbie’s don't understand. By saying that it is related to trade size would give newbie’s the false impression that if they trade 1 contract with DMA they will never experience slippage. This is a fallacy. When trading futures you are more likely to experience slippage outside of cash market hours than when trading during cash market hours. Orders during high impact NEWS releases are also likely to experience slippage. The common denominator is market liquidity.
Highly technical for me 🙂 but I'll go along with it because the slippage problem does not seem to bother me greatly.
I try to trade on pullbacks. These are contractions where buyers and sellers are fighting it out. I don't think that much slippage occurs in them but I could be wrong. The main slippage seems to happen to traders who try to spot the turn and I have known for a long time that turnspotting is a risky game to play.
Last edited:
If you trade one contract on the ES you won't experience slippage. That's what I'm trying to say. Ive never stayed up to 3am to prove it though. I can tell you that for the size I trade on the instruments I trade there is none.
DaddyJohn
Experienced member
- Messages
- 1,375
- Likes
- 9
A friend of mine recently signed up with velocity futures, he traded from his flat in London, he had huge problems with their platform, he wasn't getting filled and it kept freezing on him. Maybe they have sorted it out now. He was based. In london. I trade through Marex and have never had trouble but I know spreadbetting platforms are awful when volatility is high, and many times you can't execute electronically as they have their " phone only" message appear.
To be honest, Fins has that problem, too, but it does not worry me because I have a stop on. Manual trading must be difficult under those conditions. I believe that my spreadbet firm honours its agreements, that is, if they accept an order they execute it. Manual traders want it on a "trade at market" basis, but the spreadbetters want it on their terms. I'm afraid that they will experience slippage, but it is their fault. They are accepting a trade that the spreadbetting firm wants to trade at- What's the problem?
new_trader
Legendary member
- Messages
- 6,770
- Likes
- 1,656
This video might explain what I am trying to say. I was watching my screen at the time and even one contract would have experienced massive slippage if entered at the wrong time.
I havent read all the responses but 2 things come to mind.
1. Slippage is normal. The usual problem is that most people put in a buy @ 500 if it trades 500. By the time your order is triggered, all that was sat at 500 may be filled and who knows where the next price is, could be 501, could be 505. People are more than able to pull orders in front of a moving market and you have to hit across them to get a fill. Only if you are sitting in the order book will you definitely get the price you want. I have been a member of a few exchanges for a while and slippage of 1 - 3 points (up to 5) is expected. Getting filled at the price you actually want is rare. As mentioned by a few others further up. Most amateurs dont know what the market actually is and only when you see a ladder with orders do you appreciate what the market really is.
2. Have you called IG? They will not want to lose your custom (whatever conspiracy stories you have heard) and will probably have some advice or which platform and which settings are pertinent to you.
Last edited:
tar
Legendary member
- Messages
- 10,443
- Likes
- 1,314
wrong !
tar
Legendary member
- Messages
- 10,443
- Likes
- 1,314
There is no such thing as spread free mate unless you are a market maker ...
10 big figure spread, which is 40 ticks wide. Thats crazy, but very rare. Makes a good point though. I think the point is. The market is better than the spreadbetting companies. Well i think so anyway.
tar
Legendary member
- Messages
- 10,443
- Likes
- 1,314
OK that's fair although it is very weird , but other traders have experienced slippage , it depends on what are you doing , it is very common : spread + commission + slippage , no arguments here , even on the ES and at one contract , search elitetrader forums threads titles for the word slippage .
Hi all,
Thanks for all your valid feedback. Just to clarify a few things:
a) I traded the DAX due to the 1 point spread on offer(other indices tested were either not profitable enough or had too big a spread eg Dow Jones 4 points per trade)
b) If the opening hour price is say 6000, i would wait for the price to reach say 6025/5975 before setting up an order to sell/buy at 6000 as the price came back through its opening value with directional momentum(and hope to catch a couple of points of a headstart if the momentum is strong enough). Of course, this scenario may be executed once, a few times or not at all during the hour. At the end of the hour any open positions or orders are closed and a new hour begins.
c) My limit/stop loss was set at 15/10 as this was deemed the most profitable set up(taking the 1 point spread into account), so anything over 40% of successful trades should be profitable
d) When I was trading on low stakes(minimum requirements) all but a couple of my orders were opened at exactly the price requested(eg 6143.5), however, since I upped the stakes to suit my plan they have started executing my orders up to 3 points into the trade(in around 30% of cases) which of course lost me my initial 'headstart' in the trade in many cases(and sometimes led to a loss maker rather than a winning trade as less than 15 points were now gained before reversal)
e) At lower stakes the vast majority of my orders were filled at exactly the 10 point loss, even when prices quickly went against my position. Again, since upping the stakes, it is now common(approx 40-50% of the time) for them to sneak an extra couple of points onto my losses, even when there is proof that the exact 10 point loss price was hit during the trade!
In conclusion, it now appears that the 1 point spread which they claim to be their 'edge' is really 2-4 points when you factor in this high 'slippage' rate, which in my case will nearly always wipe out proper gains made in the day/week/month?
I see that WorldSpreads offer a zero spread platinum account for a minimum deposit? Does anybody have any info on these guys as even with a bit of 'slippage' this would be a much better option for me?
Now I might need further education here but can somebody explain to me why opposite orders would need to be fulfilled to execute my trades at the prices they quote? Also, a valid point was raised about these companies being investigated, as surely there are times when win limits are also exceeded and therefore the customer gains a bit more than their limit? Of course, you will NEVER see a situation where this holds true and we receive a little more back than we asked for, eh!!
Thanks for all your valid feedback. Just to clarify a few things:
a) I traded the DAX due to the 1 point spread on offer(other indices tested were either not profitable enough or had too big a spread eg Dow Jones 4 points per trade)
b) If the opening hour price is say 6000, i would wait for the price to reach say 6025/5975 before setting up an order to sell/buy at 6000 as the price came back through its opening value with directional momentum(and hope to catch a couple of points of a headstart if the momentum is strong enough). Of course, this scenario may be executed once, a few times or not at all during the hour. At the end of the hour any open positions or orders are closed and a new hour begins.
c) My limit/stop loss was set at 15/10 as this was deemed the most profitable set up(taking the 1 point spread into account), so anything over 40% of successful trades should be profitable
d) When I was trading on low stakes(minimum requirements) all but a couple of my orders were opened at exactly the price requested(eg 6143.5), however, since I upped the stakes to suit my plan they have started executing my orders up to 3 points into the trade(in around 30% of cases) which of course lost me my initial 'headstart' in the trade in many cases(and sometimes led to a loss maker rather than a winning trade as less than 15 points were now gained before reversal)
e) At lower stakes the vast majority of my orders were filled at exactly the 10 point loss, even when prices quickly went against my position. Again, since upping the stakes, it is now common(approx 40-50% of the time) for them to sneak an extra couple of points onto my losses, even when there is proof that the exact 10 point loss price was hit during the trade!
In conclusion, it now appears that the 1 point spread which they claim to be their 'edge' is really 2-4 points when you factor in this high 'slippage' rate, which in my case will nearly always wipe out proper gains made in the day/week/month?
I see that WorldSpreads offer a zero spread platinum account for a minimum deposit? Does anybody have any info on these guys as even with a bit of 'slippage' this would be a much better option for me?
Now I might need further education here but can somebody explain to me why opposite orders would need to be fulfilled to execute my trades at the prices they quote? Also, a valid point was raised about these companies being investigated, as surely there are times when win limits are also exceeded and therefore the customer gains a bit more than their limit? Of course, you will NEVER see a situation where this holds true and we receive a little more back than we asked for, eh!!
Well, I don't trade ten contracts but, as I have said, I don't experience slippage, either. Or maybe I do and don't know about it. Perhaps it's a question of me being so unsophisticated at trading that I don't get a good deal of the more technical details illustrated on this site. 😕
Brettus, I've looked and listened to your video. Horses for courses. I'd go nuts if I had to do that for a living and who wants it for a hobby? Whatever slippage there is in there is panic selling. I'm either short already or I'm not in.
tar
Legendary member
- Messages
- 10,443
- Likes
- 1,314
