china white
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very sage FTSE beater - the gap btwn novices and pros is rather simple - it's itchy fingers..... 
Discipline
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Really enjoyed reading this thread.
"If there is nothing to do, do nothing" - sounds simple, harder in practice. It is definetly cheaper and more productive to go to the gym or take a break, when the market is in a quiet time. No point driving yourself nuts in the interim.
other one I like is "Quality, not Quantity"
Doing fewer trades but with a higher winning percentage enables you to trade bigger size more confidently.
Also, I think there is a limit to the number of "good" decisions you can make in a day before you get tired/slack. Some days maybe a handfull, others just one or none.
So even if the trades are there but you feel you are falling behind, leave it.
"If there is nothing to do, do nothing" - sounds simple, harder in practice. It is definetly cheaper and more productive to go to the gym or take a break, when the market is in a quiet time. No point driving yourself nuts in the interim.
other one I like is "Quality, not Quantity"
Doing fewer trades but with a higher winning percentage enables you to trade bigger size more confidently.
Also, I think there is a limit to the number of "good" decisions you can make in a day before you get tired/slack. Some days maybe a handfull, others just one or none.
So even if the trades are there but you feel you are falling behind, leave it.
FTSE Beater
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Hi LambchopsLambchops said:
There is an answer. If you truly want to stop getting itchy figures try this:
Limit yourself to x number of trades a day. Once there gone, you do nothing - get up and walk away. If you start off with only making 1 trade a day, you'll be a lot more prepared to wait for the right set-up.
Doing this in itself is a discipline, but if you can do it, you'll train your mind and body to only take the best trades.
HTH
<hr>
Solid advice China White and DaxTrader
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Ah yes...that sounds familiar
Have a look at this. It helped me out a lot
http://www.trade2win.co.uk/boards/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5134
Have a look at this. It helped me out a lot
http://www.trade2win.co.uk/boards/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5134
Lambchops,
If you are going to split your contracts up you would be better off doing it on the entry not the exit.
Your greatest risk is when you enter a trade, it could turn and immediately hit your protective stop. Therefore it makes no sense to have your full size on at the entry when the risk is greatest and then reduce size when the risk is lowest.
Say you want to trade 2 contracts, you have a target of 4 points and a trailing stop of 2 pts. You put on 2 contracts at the entry and the market turns and your stopped for 2 pts/contract=4 pts lost.
Alternatively, put on 1 contract at your entry and 1 when you are 2 pts in front. If your 1st contract hits the stop you have now only lost 2 pts. When you put on your 2nd contract your stop is now at breakeven for the 1st, so if you are now stopped out you still only lose 2 pts overall.
Control your losses and the profits will come, and vice versa!
If you are going to split your contracts up you would be better off doing it on the entry not the exit.
Your greatest risk is when you enter a trade, it could turn and immediately hit your protective stop. Therefore it makes no sense to have your full size on at the entry when the risk is greatest and then reduce size when the risk is lowest.
Say you want to trade 2 contracts, you have a target of 4 points and a trailing stop of 2 pts. You put on 2 contracts at the entry and the market turns and your stopped for 2 pts/contract=4 pts lost.
Alternatively, put on 1 contract at your entry and 1 when you are 2 pts in front. If your 1st contract hits the stop you have now only lost 2 pts. When you put on your 2nd contract your stop is now at breakeven for the 1st, so if you are now stopped out you still only lose 2 pts overall.
Control your losses and the profits will come, and vice versa!
Last edited:
Newtron Bomb
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sidinuk
An excellent suggestion and alternative.
I trade forex by compounding into a move so that when the prices start to trend i can make the most of the move.
But when the prices are choppy I will only ever have my minimum lot size exposed.
An excellent suggestion and alternative.
I trade forex by compounding into a move so that when the prices start to trend i can make the most of the move.
But when the prices are choppy I will only ever have my minimum lot size exposed.
sidinuk - Thanks - Your advice makes sense. I am more worried about the exit as I have a decent batting average when buying. I can now implement stops without any problem so maybe I can solve the exit dilemma as well. Maybe targets might be the way forward?
NB - Interesting
I used to trade longer term trends in stocks that way.
With day trading(where you plan to be out by the end anyway) I find it feels more complicated. If you get into a move and then get a 2nd entry signal, fine.
But otherwise , what is to say that if you enter your 2nd lot when the 1st lot is in profit that it isn't going to turn around and hit your original stop, giving you a larger loss ?
Eg you buy half at 70, stop 60, you buy the other half as it goes to say 75, so 60 still the stop with a higher average price. In my experience moving stops early or to a technicaly insignificant place is pointless, feels good at the time but makes you miss lots of moves.
We've opened up a can of worms, many ways to skin a cat and all that
I used to trade longer term trends in stocks that way.
With day trading(where you plan to be out by the end anyway) I find it feels more complicated. If you get into a move and then get a 2nd entry signal, fine.
But otherwise , what is to say that if you enter your 2nd lot when the 1st lot is in profit that it isn't going to turn around and hit your original stop, giving you a larger loss ?
Eg you buy half at 70, stop 60, you buy the other half as it goes to say 75, so 60 still the stop with a higher average price. In my experience moving stops early or to a technicaly insignificant place is pointless, feels good at the time but makes you miss lots of moves.
We've opened up a can of worms, many ways to skin a cat and all that
Newtron Bomb
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DaxTrader
I dont usually day trade forex.
I see what you mean about if you day trade an you are looking to compound into a move it can be a little tricky when you have several positions open.
I usually look to add to a position every x points this way it will give me a reasonable profit on each entry before i consider my next entry.
The exception to this has been gbp/usd as it has been ranging so ive been at my minimum lot size and trading the range.
I dont usually day trade forex.
I see what you mean about if you day trade an you are looking to compound into a move it can be a little tricky when you have several positions open.
I usually look to add to a position every x points this way it will give me a reasonable profit on each entry before i consider my next entry.
The exception to this has been gbp/usd as it has been ranging so ive been at my minimum lot size and trading the range.
Daxtrader, If you are going to stager entries then you need to move your stop when your second entry is triggered to avoid the example that you give.
Lambchops, I prefer a time target to a point target. In my case I exit all open trades at the end of the day. Point targets are another way of cutting winners short. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. In my research for my system I found that point targets degraded the performance overall as you miss those really nice big moves that do happen quite regularly. I guess it depends on your style of trading though.
The best advice is just to backtest your ideas over a couple of years and see what works and what doesn't.
Lambchops, I prefer a time target to a point target. In my case I exit all open trades at the end of the day. Point targets are another way of cutting winners short. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. In my research for my system I found that point targets degraded the performance overall as you miss those really nice big moves that do happen quite regularly. I guess it depends on your style of trading though.
The best advice is just to backtest your ideas over a couple of years and see what works and what doesn't.
Zenda
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Lets not forget to learn this !
I am your constant companion,
I am your greatest helper or your heaviest burden.
I will push you onward or drag you down to failure.
I am at your command.
Half of the tasks that you do you might just as well
Turn over to me and I will do them quickly and correctly.
I am easily managed; you must merely be firm with me.
Show me exactly how you want something done.
After a few lessons, I will do it automatically.
I am the servant of all great people
And the regret of all failures as well.
Those who are great, I have made great.
Those who are failures, I have made failures.
I am not a machine but I will work with all its precision
Plus the intelligence of a person.
Now you may run me for profit or you may run me for ruin.
It makes no difference to me.
Take me, train me, be firm with me and
I will lay the world at your feet.
Be easy with me and I will destroy you.
I am called Habit!
Author Unknown
I am your constant companion,
I am your greatest helper or your heaviest burden.
I will push you onward or drag you down to failure.
I am at your command.
Half of the tasks that you do you might just as well
Turn over to me and I will do them quickly and correctly.
I am easily managed; you must merely be firm with me.
Show me exactly how you want something done.
After a few lessons, I will do it automatically.
I am the servant of all great people
And the regret of all failures as well.
Those who are great, I have made great.
Those who are failures, I have made failures.
I am not a machine but I will work with all its precision
Plus the intelligence of a person.
Now you may run me for profit or you may run me for ruin.
It makes no difference to me.
Take me, train me, be firm with me and
I will lay the world at your feet.
Be easy with me and I will destroy you.
I am called Habit!
Author Unknown
china white
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another word of wisdom from barrons - enjoy:
quote:
Handling Success
Consistency in day trading will come from sticking to a money
management plan. The market can be extremely humbling. Many traders
take all the credit when they are successful and blame the market
when they are not. The reality is that, with few exceptions, your
trades will never really change the market. Your 1000 shares of Intel
have almost nothing to do with the stock's next move. The market will
function with you or without you. It doesn't matter if you made
millions for the last 10 years straight - it is essential to define
what you are willing to risk now and stick with it. The main reason
that most traders fail after great successes is that their egos drag
them down. They get full of themselves.
end of quote
quote:
Handling Success
Consistency in day trading will come from sticking to a money
management plan. The market can be extremely humbling. Many traders
take all the credit when they are successful and blame the market
when they are not. The reality is that, with few exceptions, your
trades will never really change the market. Your 1000 shares of Intel
have almost nothing to do with the stock's next move. The market will
function with you or without you. It doesn't matter if you made
millions for the last 10 years straight - it is essential to define
what you are willing to risk now and stick with it. The main reason
that most traders fail after great successes is that their egos drag
them down. They get full of themselves.
end of quote
JTrader
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Discipline is the key to success without a doubt. Waiting for all your criteria to be met before entering a trade and exiting a trade as soon as your exit criteria is met or the market looks to be heading the other way.
Most of my negative trades have been a result of not doing the above and the market has a habit of making me suffer for not waiting for my optimum entry point.
One of the hardest things that I found with trading is sitting and waiting, maybe for hours on end, doing nothing, waiting for an entry signal. I have worked hard to eradicate the itchy finger phenomenon.
Most of my negative trades have been a result of not doing the above and the market has a habit of making me suffer for not waiting for my optimum entry point.
One of the hardest things that I found with trading is sitting and waiting, maybe for hours on end, doing nothing, waiting for an entry signal. I have worked hard to eradicate the itchy finger phenomenon.
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Sounds to me as if you should take up knitting - it's an instant cure to itchy finger phenomenon. :cheesy:
Zenda
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Jtrader
Perhaps you may be better suited to currency trading with the correct trading platform. For example with the better platforms you can preset entry / exit /stop /limit / levels which are completely out of the trading range with no worry about standard equity trading times (stockmarket closing etc ) - forex is 24 hours. Should the market move in the overal direction you think then you should pick up a lot of winning positions.
This sounds a better strategy than watching and waiting - Provided your not greedy and are happy with 10 - 25 points gain with limited loss - then I suggest you investigate this - ideal for a breakout mentality- the majority of spreadbetting platforms do not allow this - Good Luck - It's having a mental trading approach that suits your personality which allows you to relax - coupled together with a good dose of patience - Good luck. Z
Perhaps you may be better suited to currency trading with the correct trading platform. For example with the better platforms you can preset entry / exit /stop /limit / levels which are completely out of the trading range with no worry about standard equity trading times (stockmarket closing etc ) - forex is 24 hours. Should the market move in the overal direction you think then you should pick up a lot of winning positions.
This sounds a better strategy than watching and waiting - Provided your not greedy and are happy with 10 - 25 points gain with limited loss - then I suggest you investigate this - ideal for a breakout mentality- the majority of spreadbetting platforms do not allow this - Good Luck - It's having a mental trading approach that suits your personality which allows you to relax - coupled together with a good dose of patience - Good luck. Z
Hi jtrader,
sitting there and waiting, maybe for hours?
I just learned when doing Daytrading (up to 10-15 min charts) to do just 1 1/2 to 2 hours of trading. If I am looking 'for hours' on the screen I am getting tired and I can't concentrate and trade well.
Furthermore I try to do max 3 trades/day. ("Quality, not Quantity"):
If I have 1 winner I stop!
If I start with 1 loser I do another trade. If this is as well a loser I stop! It's not my day
If after 1 loser I have a winner I go ahead with the last trade for the day. If this is a winner I'm happy and stop.
If this is again a loser - I stop. It's not my day
My 2 cents
sitting there and waiting, maybe for hours?
I just learned when doing Daytrading (up to 10-15 min charts) to do just 1 1/2 to 2 hours of trading. If I am looking 'for hours' on the screen I am getting tired and I can't concentrate and trade well.
Furthermore I try to do max 3 trades/day. ("Quality, not Quantity"):
If I have 1 winner I stop!
If I start with 1 loser I do another trade. If this is as well a loser I stop! It's not my day
If after 1 loser I have a winner I go ahead with the last trade for the day. If this is a winner I'm happy and stop.
If this is again a loser - I stop. It's not my day
My 2 cents
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