Career Change Advice - Sales to Prop Trader

[bobsteiner33]

I need some advice. I am 28 years old in sales, making enough money to pay the bills, support the family, etc.. however, I have been interested in pursuing a career as a prop trader. I have a friend that said he could get me in his firm trading futures, no problem, but he mentioned, you need to know that you are not going to make any money for about 6 months or so.
I have no experience in trading, however, I have this gut feeling I can do well at this. I realize it is going to take time for me to understand what I'm doing and I do realize there is a huge possiblity that I may be horrible.
If I don't take this risk, (risk being, quitting my current job) I may regret it and wonder, what if???

Any suggestions....

 

[arabianights]

You sound like you understand the risks. Understand the odds are stacked against you. Decision is up to you.

 

[bobsteiner33]

You sound like you understand the risks. Understand the odds are stacked against you. Decision is up to you.

Thank you. Any other advice, ex. books to help make the learning curve a little easier, faster?

 

[faro0485]

Thank you. Any other advice, ex. books to help make the learning curve a little easier, faster?

Get rid of that dangerous gut feeling of yours and get yourself a trading mentor/coach. You're friend might know an experienced old trader. You'll need education and experience with your own money. You can do that in your spare time, you don't need to quit your job yet. Oh and it will take at least 2 years for your mind to adjust to handling the emotional stresses. Unless you've already passed that.

Heck open up a tiny $100 account with Oanda and experience the taste of sweet and sour forex.

 

[TWI]

I suggest you create a personal cahsflow with your trading capital taken out to see how you and your familly will be doing if you try this full time. It will take time indeed and although going to a prop firm may sound like a good idea you may find their methods do not suit you. There are many ways to make money in the markets and you need to find your own edge. I would suggest you do not go in blind but start learning now and keep your job going. Wait until you have dipped in a toe before you take the plunge. Good Luck.

 

[toxictrading]

good advice but its very difficult to just dip a toe in and still have a bloody good swim !
and to be honest the reason most people fail is because they do just that, they just dip a toe in and this is not the business where that will work (harsh but true)
so whats the risk here ?
give up you job, ok risky, but so is walking down the road
you will indeed have to have enough money to tide you over for at least 12 months once you start trading, very few hit the ground running and make de big dollar bills
yes some do, but dont bank on being one of them,
if you have enough cash to live for that kinda time then go for it,
whats the worst thing that can happen, you dont make it and you end up in sales, always sales jobs to be had

good luck

 

[Crap Buddist]

Check out the support and resistance of the WIFE !!! ??

Any suggestions....

umm, ok, well discuss it with the boss (the wife) what kind of vibes are you getting from the Mrs. ? Does she start swearing ? Not usually a good sign but we can work with it, its all about timing, thats all.

I think most traders need a "material" amount of time usually to learn the craft and any personal pressures may have a significant impact on loving relationships. Lets face it most will moan if you haven't put the bin out, or cut the grass!!

But if you are fortunate to have a partner who plays it from the "darling, I understand , I love you for you being you and all that you may be ,for better or worse, richer or poorer, sickness n health, the greatest gift I can give is to stand by your side" camp then ,1.) thats one less potential worry for ya. 2.) Can I have her phone number ?!!

Check out the support and resistance of the WIFE !!! ?? I tell you this though if you dont get support from your partner, that change your partner has to undergo (if she is to accept you and your ambitions) if you are to stay together, is considerable.(understated)

In short mate, you not only have to evolve but you might have the task of getting your wife through trading and she dont even trade !

Discuss it with your wife, plan to downsize your life, while thats happening (12 months or so) get on and do some research, trading techniques that your mates firm teaches(if any etc) all the rest of it that you head into.

You have the gift of life and free will, carry on.

 

[bobsteiner33]

umm, ok, well discuss it with the boss (the wife) what kind of vibes are you getting from the Mrs. ? Does she start swearing ? Not usually a good sign but we can work with it, its all about timing, thats all.

I think most traders need a "material" amount of time usually to learn the craft and any personal pressures may have a significant impact on loving relationships. Lets face it most will moan if you haven't put the bin out, or cut the grass!!

But if you are fortunate to have a partner who plays it from the "darling, I understand , I love you for you being you and all that you may be ,for better or worse, richer or poorer, sickness n health, the greatest gift I can give is to stand by your side" camp then ,1.) thats one less potential worry for ya. 2.) Can I have her phone number ?!!

Check out the support and resistance of the WIFE !!! ?? I tell you this though if you dont get support from your partner, that change your partner has to undergo (if she is to accept you and your ambitions) if you are to stay together, is considerable.(understated)

In short mate, you not only have to evolve but you might have the task of getting your wife through trading and she dont even trade !

Discuss it with your wife, plan to downsize your life, while thats happening (12 months or so) get on and do some research, trading techniques that your mates firm teaches(if any etc) all the rest of it that you head into.

You have the gift of life and free will, carry on.

Thank you all for you input! I greatly appreciate it. By the way, the wife is very supportive, however, the issue of having enough money to stay afloat for a 6 - 12 months may be an issue.

 

[firewalker99]

You sound like you understand the risks. Understand the odds are stacked against you. Decision is up to you.

The odds are stacked against you, but... (click image)

 

[grantx]

Bob,

"to stay afloat for a 6 - 12 months may be an issue." If it's an issue now, it will be when you start trading. This one psychological burden that outburdens every other. Save for a twelve month float and learn as much as you can in the meantime. The market will wait for you.

Grant.

 

[DC STOXX]

i Agree, I think you should save up enough money to live on for "at least" a year without any issues, and to be honest 18 months would not be conservative either, harsh but true.

You would hate to be 9-10 months into trading full time, to have learnt so much and feel you are so close to "clicking" but then you have no fund to continue or have to start taking out loans...

 

[grantx]

18 month is better - if you spend a year learning to trade and it doesn't work out, at least you'll have some funds to carry you over until you find another job.

Grant.

 

[faro0485]

People,
Am I the only one that recommends Oanda and their feature of "trade as little as $1" with a 50:1 leverage!?

Trading is still trading, whether it be forex or futures. Give me a reason why you can't trade after work.

 

[DC STOXX]

People,
Am I the only one that recommends Oanda and their feature of "trade as little as $1" with a 50:1 leverage!?

Trading is still trading, whether it be forex or futures. Give me a reason why you can't trade after work.

You can trade after work

But thats not what we are talking about, we are talking about making trading your full time job, where the markets provide you with 100% of your income

 

[bobsteiner33]

Thank you all for your wise words of advice.
Question: Any suggestions on working both jobs for a month or two? Trading at night and sales during the day. That way, money is not an issue (at the start) and I get somewhat of a feel if this is what I really want to pursue. If it is, then I go for it.

 

[faro0485]

Thank you all for your wise words of advice.
Question: Any suggestions on working both jobs for a month or two? Trading at night and sales during the day. That way, money is not an issue (at the start) and I get somewhat of a feel if this is what I really want to pursue. If it is, then I go for it.

Yes first find a broker to work with. I recommend an account that will let you trade small amounts and with a leverage capped at 100 to 1 to 50 to 1. The link to oanda is up there. Keep the account small and the trades small.

Next you need to learn the basics, some can be found in "Traderpedia" link above.

Then you need a trading plan - kinda like a business plan but for traders. There's one here.

Oh I'd recommend getting your wife to read all of that and be a partner. Trading can seriously get boring if you're trading on your own. Perhaps even open an account between the two of you and see which one could figure out the market before the other (as well as a joint trading account).

I also recommend a book called The Art of Learning by josh waitzkin.

 

[Hunter08]

Prop trading is for traders who have a clue what they are doing in the markets, don't bother trying to get a job as a rookie, you will crash and burn all your contacts.

I suggest you learn to trade first trading small on a real life account using only 2 or 3 strategies.

I would trade rarley, and try to show a consistant approach as apposed to an emotional rollercoaster of stupid day trading.

try to trade trends only and always use a risk reward of more than 2 to 1. Let profits run if the intraday trend has moved below the previous days lows or at leats below the mid point of the session.

My prop experience has proven that trading 4 to 8 times per month is more than enough to make over 100K per year in commissions.

 

[DC STOXX]

Prop trading is for traders who have a clue what they are doing in the markets, don't bother trying to get a job as a rookie, you will crash and burn all your contacts.

I suggest you learn to trade first trading small on a real life account using only 2 or 3 strategies.

I would trade rarley, and try to show a consistant approach as apposed to an emotional rollercoaster of stupid day trading.

try to trade trends only and always use a risk reward of more than 2 to 1. Let profits run if the intraday trend has moved below the previous days lows or at leats below the mid point of the session.

My prop experience has proven that trading 4 to 8 times per month is more than enough to make over 100K per year in commissions.

Dont call day trading stupid just because you cannot do it profitably, I personally know people who make millions each year from day trading.

 

[Hunter08]

Iwas merely trying to say that an account full of emotional intraday trades which show no consistant approach will hamper your chances when trying to land acocunts.

Hedge funds day trade , Even I day trade, I am basically saying to trade less often with more precision.

And just to add a comment here, I don't care who i know or who you know, my experience has shown that all great traders in the past and all traders I have met, and my own track record... all show success when thet don't over trade, nor do they actively trade over and over each day. They trade around 10 to 20 times per month, and trade very highly probable trades.

Hedge funds primarily position trade, I used to work with one.

 

[gooseman]

what market do you work in? it may be the case that the experience you have through sales can give you a leg up going into prop trading.