Capitalism

Have to disagree with you F on this point. The rich and clever are not usually altruistic ( with exceptions like philanthropists ). The capitalist rich and clever are balancing just how much they can squeeze out of the masses before they rebel seriously.

poor people can also be not nice, I think people are nice or not pleasant and does not depend on how much money they have....

Hi Pat and Fugazsy

i would have to agree with you both to a degree

I know of really nice humble very clever and very rich people - who are really nice caring reasonable people - and others maybe even richer and and very clever who are real sh*ts

Similar - there are people who have no real wealth and no formal education who are the "salt of the earth " type - always trying to be helpful and always pleasant and happy. Then you have others of no wealth and no education who think the world owes them a life and hate everyone who they look upon as being happier then them.

But these are normally the extremes - just like the extremes of Capitalism and Socialism - the middle -" common majority ground" can offer maybe the compromise or best of both worlds.

Also notice many quotes coming from the 2 ultra right wingers

Give me any quote - said or written before today - ie in the past whether 10 yrs ago or 100 yrs ago - and it can be improved.

That's always because we have more knowledge today and tomorrow than we did in the past

Markets are slow - hope the news get things kicked off again

Regards


F
 
Your 'arguments' against capitalism are unoriginal and as old as the hills. They have all been refuted by Scholars and Nobel prize winning economists. I have quoted some of their work in reply to your incorrect assumptions. I too could go on and on about how wrong you are.

Capitalism alone is doomed to failure.

The aim of capitalism is to create profit, it has no regard for human beings.

Capitalism stifles invention.
Once you have an idea and you've become dominant you can buy out other companies who come up with competing ideas. Then when you've wiped out the competition why bother coming up with a new product? Just keep selling the same old cheap rubbish to people.


When people assume, or claim, that there is a difference between the producers and the consumers of the products of big businesses, they are badly mistaken. In American department stores you hear the slogan, "the customer is always right." And this customer is the same man who produces in the factory those things which are sold in the department stores. The people who think that the power of big business is enormous are mistaken also, since big business depends entirely on the patronage of those who buy its products: the biggest enterprise loses its power and its influence when it loses its customers.

Fifty or 60 years ago it was said in almost all capitalist countries that the railroad companies were too big and too powerful; they had a monopoly; it was impossible to compete with them. It was alleged that, in the field of transportation, capitalism had already reached a stage at which it had destroyed itself, for it had eliminated competition. What people overlooked was the fact that the power of the railroads depended on their ability to serve people better than any other method of transportation. Of course it would have been ridiculous to compete with one of these big railroad companies by building another railroad parallel to the old line, since the old line was sufficient to serve existing needs. But very soon there came other competitors. Freedom of competition does not mean that you can succeed simply by imitating or copying precisely what someone else has done. Freedom of the press does not mean that you have the right to copy what another man has written and thus to acquire the success which this other man has duly merited on account of his achievements. It means that you have the right to write something different. Freedom of competition concerning railroads, for example, means that you are free to invent something, to do something, which will challenge the railroads and place them in a very precarious competitive situation.

In the United States the competition to the railroads — in the form of buses, automobiles, trucks, and airplanes — has caused the railroads to suffer and to be almost completely defeated, as far as passenger transportation is concerned.

The development of capitalism consists in everyone's having the right to serve the customer better and/or more cheaply. And this method, this principle, has, within a comparatively short time, transformed the whole world. It has made possible an unprecedented increase in world population.

In 18th-century England, the land could support only 6 million people at a very low standard of living. Today more than 50 million people enjoy a much higher standard of living than even the rich enjoyed during the 18th-century. And today's standard of living in England would probably be still higher, had not a great deal of the energy of the British been wasted in what were, from various points of view, avoidable political and military "adventures."

These are the facts about capitalism. Thus, if an Englishman — or, for that matter, any other man in any country of the world — says today to his friends that he is opposed to capitalism, there is a wonderful way to answer him: "You know that the population of this planet is now ten times greater than it was in the ages preceding capitalism; you know that all men today enjoy a higher standard of living than your ancestors did before the age of capitalism. But how do you know that you are the one out of ten who would have lived in the absence of capitalism? The mere fact that you are living today is proof that capitalism has succeeded, whether or not you consider your own life very valuable."


Capitalism is not good for the consumer. It is not in the interests of corporations to create a product that is efficient and reliable. Once you have your oligopoly or better yet monopoly, try built in obsolescence to keep those consumers coming back.


Capitalism will result in dynasty’s.
This is being evidenced all around the world in Banking, Media, Government (Bush, Clinton, Bush Clinton? How can that happen in the Mecca of capitalism.

I could go on, (I generally do).


Two hundred years ago, before the advent of capitalism, a man's social status was fixed from the beginning to the end of his life; he inherited it from his ancestors, and it never changed. If he was born poor, he always remained poor, and if he was born rich — a lord or a duke — he kept his dukedom and the property that went with it for the rest of his life.

As for manufacturing, the primitive processing industries of those days existed almost exclusively for the benefit of the wealthy. Most of the people (90 percent or more of the European population) worked the land and did not come in contact with the city-oriented processing industries. This rigid system of feudal society prevailed in the most developed areas of Europe for many hundreds of years.

However, as the rural population expanded, there developed a surplus of people on the land. For this surplus of population without inherited land or estates, there was not enough to do, nor was it possible for them to work in the processing industries; the kings of the cities denied them access. The numbers of these "outcasts" continued to grow, and still no one knew what to do with them. They were, in the full sense of the word, "proletarians," outcasts whom the government could only put into the workhouse or the poorhouse. In some sections of Europe, especially in the Netherlands and in England, they became so numerous that, by the 18th century, they were a real menace to the preservation of the prevailing social system.

Today, in discussing similar conditions in places like India or other developing countries, we must not forget that, in 18th-century England, conditions were much worse. At that time, England had a population of 6 or 7 million people, but of those 6 or 7 million people, more than 1 million, probably 2 million, were simply poor outcasts for whom the existing social system made no provision. What to do with these outcasts was one of the great problems of 18th-century England.

Another great problem was the lack of raw materials. The British, very seriously, had to ask themselves this question: What are we going to do in the future, when our forests will no longer give us the wood we need for our industries and for heating our houses? For the ruling classes it was a desperate situation. The statesmen did not know what to do, and the ruling gentry were absolutely without any ideas on how to improve conditions.

Out of this serious social situation emerged the beginnings of modern capitalism. There were some persons among those outcasts, among those poor people, who tried to organize others to set up small shops which could produce something. This was an innovation. These innovators did not produce expensive goods suitable only for the upper classes; they produced cheaper products for everyone's needs. And this was the origin of capitalism as it operates today. It was the beginning of mass production, the fundamental principle of capitalistic industry. Whereas the old processing industries serving the rich people in the cities had existed almost exclusively for the demands of the upper classes, the new capitalist industries began to produce things that could be purchased by the general population. It was mass production to satisfy the needs of the masses.
 
Your 'arguments' against capitalism are unoriginal and as old as the hills.
...............
These are the facts about capitalism.

..............
Out of this serious social situation emerged the beginnings of modern capitalism. There were some persons among those outcasts, among those poor people, who tried to organize others to set up small shops which could produce something. This was an innovation. These innovators did not produce expensive goods suitable only for the upper classes; they produced cheaper products for everyone's needs. And this was the origin of capitalism as it operates today. It was the beginning of mass production,


This is really going to confuse you and one dimension hhiusa - you will not be able to understand this

I agree - yes agree with the majority of what you have said their about Capitalism

I have liked your post n_t

BUT

I also agree with Postman's negative comments on Capitalism

For me - life is not just a simple black or white - a yes or a no

Its full of devil in the detail grey areas that can be interpreted according to you bias

I try to have no bias.

I am neither ultra right wing - or ultra left wing

I accept that life is not perfect - ie the same as human beings

I just cannot understand why you two only see one argument - and that like all theories - its flawed

Regards


F
 
...
The people who think that the power of big business is enormous are mistaken also, since big business depends entirely on the patronage of those who buy its products: the biggest enterprise loses its power and its influence when it loses its customers.

....

Wrong! Customers have been disenfranchised.

Nowadays if you dont like your 'Cheetos' and switch to 'Fritos' then your still lining the pockets of the top tier capitalists.

Previously independent brands such "Ben and Jerry's ice cream (now owned by Unilever), Innocent Smoothies (Coca Cola), Green and Black's chocolate (Cadbury/Kraft) and Copella apple juice (Tropicana/Pepsi) are among the many formerly independent brands now owned by large corporations."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-20943739

If people get fed up with brand Tesco, then Tesco just create a new brand based on what a marketing company says consumers like.

You are naively under the belief that you actually have a choice, wake up and smell the Harris Hoole (sorry, Tescos) coffee.
 

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Wrong! Customers have been disenfranchised.

Nowadays if you dont like your 'Cheetos' and switch to 'Fritos' then your still lining the pockets of the top tier capitalists.

Previously independent brands such "Ben and Jerry's ice cream (now owned by Unilever), Innocent Smoothies (Coca Cola), Green and Black's chocolate (Cadbury/Kraft) and Copella apple juice (Tropicana/Pepsi) are among the many formerly independent brands now owned by large corporations."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-20943739

If people get fed up with brand Tesco, then Tesco just create a new brand based on what a marketing company says consumers like.

You are naively under the belief that you actually have a choice, wake up and smell the Harris Hoole (sorry, Tescos) coffee.

Why are you getting your knickers in a twist? I am not unhappy with my choices, but if you are there is absolutely nothing stopping you from creating your own brand. Instead of whining in a forum, get of your arЅe and invent something new to satisfy the disenfranchised consumers you care so deeply about. Go on, the dragons are waiting for your new product...itching to give away some of their money to invest in your new product or idea...have you actually got any?
 
...


These are the facts about capitalism. Thus, if an Englishman — or, for that matter, any other man in any country of the world — says today to his friends that he is opposed to capitalism, there is a wonderful way to answer him: "You know that the population of this planet is now ten times greater than it was in the ages preceding capitalism; you know that all men today enjoy a higher standard of living than your ancestors did before the age of capitalism. But how do you know that you are the one out of ten who would have lived in the absence of capitalism? The mere fact that you are living today is proof that capitalism has succeeded, whether or not you consider your own life very valuable."


/QUOTE]

I think Julius Ceaser said something similar but without the word capitalism.
 
...


Two hundred years ago, before the advent of capitalism, a man's social status was fixed from the beginning to the end of his life; he inherited it from his ancestors, and it never changed. If he was born poor, he always remained poor, and if he was born rich — a lord or a duke — he kept his dukedom and the property that went with it for the rest of his life.

...

And as stated before this is what it will be like again when Capitalism runs its natural course to a select few dynasties. Do you really want to be controlled by a Bush?

(I'm breaking it down into small chunks so its easier for you to understand.)
 
...

Another great problem was the lack of raw materials. The British, very seriously, had to ask themselves this question: What are we going to do in the future, when our forests will no longer give us the wood we need for our industries and for heating our houses? For the ruling classes it was a desperate situation. The statesmen did not know what to do, and the ruling gentry were absolutely without any ideas on how to improve conditions.

....

At least I have the courtesy to quote my references instead of just copying chunks of text from the internet and palming them off as my own ideas.

Economic Policy: Thoughts for Today and Tomorrow. By Ludwig Von Mises

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id...s the wood we need for our industries&f=false
 
And as stated before this is what it will be like again when Capitalism runs its natural course to a select few dynasties. Do you really want to be controlled by a Bush?

(I'm breaking it down into small chunks so its easier for you to understand.)

Oh, I see, you have the gift of prophecy now, so that makes you right. How do you explain the collapse of the U.S.S.R?
 
Your 'arguments' against capitalism are unoriginal and as old as the hills. They have all been refuted by Scholars and Nobel prize winning economists. I have quoted some of their work in reply to your incorrect assumptions. I too could go on and on about how wrong you are.




When people assume, or claim, that there is a difference between the producers and the consumers of the products of big businesses, they are badly mistaken. In American department stores you hear the slogan, "the customer is always right." And this customer is the same man who produces in the factory those things which are sold in the department stores. The people who think that the power of big business is enormous are mistaken also, since big business depends entirely on the patronage of those who buy its products: the biggest enterprise loses its power and its influence when it loses its customers.

Fifty or 60 years ago it was said in almost all capitalist countries that the railroad companies were too big and too powerful; they had a monopoly; it was impossible to compete with them. It was alleged that, in the field of transportation, capitalism had already reached a stage at which it had destroyed itself, for it had eliminated competition. What people overlooked was the fact that the power of the railroads depended on their ability to serve people better than any other method of transportation. Of course it would have been ridiculous to compete with one of these big railroad companies by building another railroad parallel to the old line, since the old line was sufficient to serve existing needs. But very soon there came other competitors. Freedom of competition does not mean that you can succeed simply by imitating or copying precisely what someone else has done. Freedom of the press does not mean that you have the right to copy what another man has written and thus to acquire the success which this other man has duly merited on account of his achievements. It means that you have the right to write something different. Freedom of competition concerning railroads, for example, means that you are free to invent something, to do something, which will challenge the railroads and place them in a very precarious competitive situation.

In the United States the competition to the railroads — in the form of buses, automobiles, trucks, and airplanes — has caused the railroads to suffer and to be almost completely defeated, as far as passenger transportation is concerned.

The development of capitalism consists in everyone's having the right to serve the customer better and/or more cheaply. And this method, this principle, has, within a comparatively short time, transformed the whole world. It has made possible an unprecedented increase in world population.

In 18th-century England, the land could support only 6 million people at a very low standard of living. Today more than 50 million people enjoy a much higher standard of living than even the rich enjoyed during the 18th-century. And today's standard of living in England would probably be still higher, had not a great deal of the energy of the British been wasted in what were, from various points of view, avoidable political and military "adventures."

These are the facts about capitalism. Thus, if an Englishman — or, for that matter, any other man in any country of the world — says today to his friends that he is opposed to capitalism, there is a wonderful way to answer him: "You know that the population of this planet is now ten times greater than it was in the ages preceding capitalism; you know that all men today enjoy a higher standard of living than your ancestors did before the age of capitalism. But how do you know that you are the one out of ten who would have lived in the absence of capitalism? The mere fact that you are living today is proof that capitalism has succeeded, whether or not you consider your own life very valuable."








Two hundred years ago, before the advent of capitalism, a man's social status was fixed from the beginning to the end of his life; he inherited it from his ancestors, and it never changed. If he was born poor, he always remained poor, and if he was born rich — a lord or a duke — he kept his dukedom and the property that went with it for the rest of his life.

As for manufacturing, the primitive processing industries of those days existed almost exclusively for the benefit of the wealthy. Most of the people (90 percent or more of the European population) worked the land and did not come in contact with the city-oriented processing industries. This rigid system of feudal society prevailed in the most developed areas of Europe for many hundreds of years.

However, as the rural population expanded, there developed a surplus of people on the land. For this surplus of population without inherited land or estates, there was not enough to do, nor was it possible for them to work in the processing industries; the kings of the cities denied them access. The numbers of these "outcasts" continued to grow, and still no one knew what to do with them. They were, in the full sense of the word, "proletarians," outcasts whom the government could only put into the workhouse or the poorhouse. In some sections of Europe, especially in the Netherlands and in England, they became so numerous that, by the 18th century, they were a real menace to the preservation of the prevailing social system.

Today, in discussing similar conditions in places like India or other developing countries, we must not forget that, in 18th-century England, conditions were much worse. At that time, England had a population of 6 or 7 million people, but of those 6 or 7 million people, more than 1 million, probably 2 million, were simply poor outcasts for whom the existing social system made no provision. What to do with these outcasts was one of the great problems of 18th-century England.

Another great problem was the lack of raw materials. The British, very seriously, had to ask themselves this question: What are we going to do in the future, when our forests will no longer give us the wood we need for our industries and for heating our houses? For the ruling classes it was a desperate situation. The statesmen did not know what to do, and the ruling gentry were absolutely without any ideas on how to improve conditions.

Out of this serious social situation emerged the beginnings of modern capitalism. There were some persons among those outcasts, among those poor people, who tried to organize others to set up small shops which could produce something. This was an innovation. These innovators did not produce expensive goods suitable only for the upper classes; they produced cheaper products for everyone's needs. And this was the origin of capitalism as it operates today. It was the beginning of mass production, the fundamental principle of capitalistic industry. Whereas the old processing industries serving the rich people in the cities had existed almost exclusively for the demands of the upper classes, the new capitalist industries began to produce things that could be purchased by the general population. It was mass production to satisfy the needs of the masses.



My goodness - the history and development of the World and all the inventions are attributed to pure Capitalism and none of it to any other systems of governance, social order, wars or democracy.

The system you two prescribe as Capitalism is not what is true capitalistic system at all.

I strongly concur with jsc's link (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism)

Here is another take on the really really free market - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Really_Really_Free_Market

Fortunately, collectively and with the application of common sense from the majority, you two can remain in your hypothetical utopian wonder World inside your little heads. Two peas in a pod. :LOL:
 

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When people assume, or claim, that there is a difference between the producers and the consumers of the products of big businesses, they are badly mistaken. In American department stores you hear the slogan, "the customer is always right." And this customer is the same man who produces in the factory those things which are sold in the department stores. The people who think that the power of big business is enormous are mistaken also, since big business depends entirely on the patronage of those who buy its products: the biggest enterprise loses its power and its influence when it loses its customers.

I have several examples to support @new_trader's claims about big conglomerates existing for the customer, because many times it is an ingenious customer who forms his own business.

Here is a list of from the top 120 most trusted brands. They have earned a reputation for keeping the consumer in mind and making things ergonomic and customer service oriented.

1. Sephora
2. In-N-Out Burger
3. Publix
4. Patrón
5. Trader Joe's
6. The Ritz-Carlton Hotel Company
7. Panera Bread
8. Virgin America
9. Southwest Airlines
10. Apple Store - They have a cult following because they make great products, which are user friender, do not suffer from feature bloat and are extremely reliable. You do not have to have anti-virus software and you do not have to defrag your Mac. Apple has grown so big because so many people have grown tired of the complexities of the PC, not to mention their non-stable releases (Vista). By the way Microsoft did not even come close to making this list.

11. Whole Foods Market
14. Nordstrom
32. Starbucks - It started up a full 7 years after Coffee Bean and quickly amassed market share due in most part to their ability to make people feel exclusivity and great customer service.
48. IKEA
54. Grey Goose
72. Norwegian Cruise Line
101. Michael Kors
114. JetBlue Airways
120. Cold Stone Creamery

Fifty or 60 years ago it was said in almost all capitalist countries that the railroad companies were too big and too powerful; they had a monopoly; it was impossible to compete with them. It was alleged that, in the field of transportation, capitalism had already reached a stage at which it had destroyed itself, for it had eliminated competition. What people overlooked was the fact that the power of the railroads depended on their ability to serve people better than any other method of transportation. Of course it would have been ridiculous to compete with one of these big railroad companies by building another railroad parallel to the old line, since the old line was sufficient to serve existing needs. But very soon there came other competitors. Freedom of competition does not mean that you can succeed simply by imitating or copying precisely what someone else has done. Freedom of the press does not mean that you have the right to copy what another man has written and thus to acquire the success which this other man has duly merited on account of his achievements. It means that you have the right to write something different. Freedom of competition concerning railroads, for example, means that you are free to invent something, to do something, which will challenge the railroads and place them in a very precarious competitive situation.

In the United States the competition to the railroads — in the form of buses, automobiles, trucks, and airplanes — has caused the railroads to suffer and to be almost completely defeated, as far as passenger transportation is concerned.

The development of capitalism consists in everyone's having the right to serve the customer better and/or more cheaply. And this method, this principle, has, within a comparatively short time, transformed the whole world. It has made possible an unprecedented increase in world population.

Also, the interstate highway system was created by the Federal-Aid Highway Act of 1956, which connected places like never before. England soon followed suit, creating highways between 1959 and 1968. The M1 was the first major highway (carriageway) to be built in England.

In 18th-century England, the land could support only 6 million people at a very low standard of living. Today more than 50 million people enjoy a much higher standard of living than even the rich enjoyed during the 18th-century. And today's standard of living in England would probably be still higher, had not a great deal of the energy of the British been wasted in what were, from various points of view, avoidable political and military "adventures."

Two hundred years ago, before the advent of capitalism, a man's social status was fixed from the beginning to the end of his life; he inherited it from his ancestors, and it never changed. If he was born poor, he always remained poor, and if he was born rich — a lord or a duke — he kept his dukedom and the property that went with it for the rest of his life.


Remnants of this are left behind in our surnames. In 1066, King William (William the Conqueror) decided people needed surnames in order to take the first country wide census for tax purposes. Names mostly given by profession or geography (toponyms). If you worked in a mill, you were Miller. If you were a mason worker, you were Masoner. Thatcher for a thatcher, smith for a blacksmith, shephard for a shephard and so on. The fact that we kept these surnames for so long, shows how unlikely it was for someone to move around into a different social class.
 
Car study

- What the consumer wants - - under £10k - 150 mph - 150 mpg - 5 yrs free servicing - every latest gadget possible - Rolls Royce reliability and build quality - loads of spec choice - loads of availability - hold value for 3 yrs with no more than 25% loss of value

What manufacturer wants - High profit factor -

End result - neither wins - so compromise

The customer is King - but once the company is Global and very large - there are loads more customers and so they then take a lower ranking - and they have to accept they cannot call the tune so much

Apple are brilliant - they now can treat the customer like dirt - and get away with it

With regards to innovation and new technology - the drugs industry have made sure its been controlled to suit them - they dont want a cure for cancer yet

I love capitalism - but I also love the "little man" the David and Goliath scenario - and the good parts of socialism - taking care of the sick and ill and the ones who fall on bad times - that's why we need strong laws and regulations - ie Referees if you don't like the word Government -

Surely compromise is common sense hhiusa ? ;-)
 
Car study

- What the consumer wants - - under £10k - 150 mph - 150 mpg - 5 yrs free servicing - every latest gadget possible - Rolls Royce reliability and build quality - loads of spec choice - loads of availability - hold value for 3 yrs with no more than 25% loss of value

What manufacturer wants - High profit factor -

End result - neither wins - so compromise

The customer is King - but once the company is Global and very large - there are loads more customers and so they then take a lower ranking - and they have to accept they cannot call the tune so much

Apple are brilliant - they now can treat the customer like dirt - and get away with it

With regards to innovation and new technology - the drugs industry have made sure its been controlled to suit them - they dont want a cure for cancer yet

I love capitalism - but I also love the "little man" the David and Goliath scenario - and the good parts of socialism - taking care of the sick and ill and the ones who fall on bad times - that's why we need strong laws and regulations - ie Referees if you don't like the word Government -

Surely compromise is common sense hhiusa ? ;-)


WHO SAID THE STATE HAS NO ROLE IN CAPITALISM?? Who? Me? hhiusa?

Talk about a straw man argument!
 
Car study

- What the consumer wants - - under £10k - 150 mph - 150 mpg - 5 yrs free servicing - every latest gadget possible - Rolls Royce reliability and build quality - loads of spec choice - loads of availability - hold value for 3 yrs with no more than 25% loss of value

What manufacturer wants - High profit factor -

End result - neither wins - so compromise

The customer is King - but once the company is Global and very large - there are loads more customers and so they then take a lower ranking - and they have to accept they cannot call the tune so much

Apple are brilliant - they now can treat the customer like dirt - and get away with it

With regards to innovation and new technology - the drugs industry have made sure its been controlled to suit them - they dont want a cure for cancer yet

I love capitalism - but I also love the "little man" the David and Goliath scenario - and the good parts of socialism - taking care of the sick and ill and the ones who fall on bad times - that's why we need strong laws and regulations - ie Referees if you don't like the word Government -

Surely compromise is common sense hhiusa ? ;-)

You obviously did not read anything @new_trader and I wrote, so I will leave it to him for a bit to put you in your place and he has done for a while now.

Apple treats their customers amazing according to me. My iPhone has been replaced them 4 times because I dropped it or did some form of accidental damage. The insurance is only supposed to cover two incidents in two years but they seem to have ignored that and given me more. The last time they replaced my iPhone, they were out of the previous model so they gave me a newer one.

You keep derailing the conversation talking about everything except capitalism.
 
I have several examples to support @new_trader's claims about big conglomerates existing for the customer, because many times it is an ingenious customer who forms his own business.

Here is a list of from the top 120 most trusted brands. They have earned a reputation for keeping the consumer in mind and making things ergonomic and customer service oriented.

1. Sephora
2. In-N-Out Burger
3. Publix
4. Patrón
5. Trader Joe's
6. The Ritz-Carlton Hotel Company
7. Panera Bread
8. Virgin America
...

I'm guessing the people who own these companies haven't succumbed (yet) to the competition.
On reading Richard Bransons biography he is clear that British Airways did everything in its power to shut him down and therefore reduce competition (and choice). There will always be a few bad apples who dont conform to the full capitalist ideals.

Look what happened to Cadbury chocolate when Kraft took it over and wanted to cut costs to make more money all in the name of capitalism, they didnt have the customer in mind then. It wont be long before Ben and Jerry ice cream is homogenised into tasting like a Cornetto. And when a new ice cream comes along that will be swallowed up and ruined too.

Capitalism ruins good products in the name of profit, and kills off competition.

(By the way Starbucks coffee is shockingly bad, they will soon be off that list).
 
WHO SAID THE STATE HAS NO ROLE IN CAPITALISM?? Who? Me? hhiusa?

Talk about a straw man argument!

The state is government - you are anti governments - you only want free capitalism - with no controls - ie raw capitalism

Clarify if this in not the case ??
 
Apple treats their customers amazingly well according to me. My iPhone has been replaced by them 4 times because I dropped it or did some form of accidental damage. The insurance is only supposed to cover two incidents in two years but they seem to have ignored that and given me more. The last time they replaced my iPhone, they were out of the previous model so they gave me a newer one.

.

Are you accident prone or just a clumsy oaf ? Apple by your standards should have told you to bog off and stop pestering them. It was your fault believe it or not ! OR did you sell them on for a profit ? I mean that's capitalism, isn't it ?

Don't bother to thank me for correcting your English ( American ) BTW

:p
 
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You keep derailing the conversation talking about everything except capitalism.


I am being a true right wing Capitalist - ie

I am in control - I dominate - I call the shots - you are lucky that you are allowed to comment etc etc - so why would I listen to anything you say ??

Apple - agree - they are a super Capitalist mega company

But they are able to give you replacement IPhone because they have built in super high profits off everything they sell

They seek extreme profits by clever technology and you are being mislead to think you have a brilliant product - along with a super back up etc - ie superior service.

They are my top favourite company - because they get away with near murder

Every product as a built in shelf life - every product needs different charging units - all costing more money - they are a brilliant marketing company and they should be given high praise

Remember I am a Capitalist - I only see pound notes

The customer can so easily be mislead

Apple Iphone 6 - what $700 -800 + I reckon proper selling price $250

Do you pay $10 for a loaf of bread - or $15 for bottled water ??

Other phone companies just love Apple - they keep all prices artificially high

The public are conned - but they still are happy with Apple's products

All good stuff -
 
I am being a true right wing Capitalist - ie

I am in control - I dominate - I call the shots - you are lucky that you are allowed to comment etc etc - so why would I listen to anything you say ??

Apple - agree - they are a super Capitalist mega company

But they are able to give you replacement IPhone because they have built in super high profits off everything they sell

They seek extreme profits by clever technology and you are being mislead to think you have a brilliant product - along with a super back up etc - ie superior service.

They are my top favourite company - because they get away with near murder

Every product as a built in shelf life - every product needs different charging units - all costing more money - they are a brilliant marketing company and they should be given high praise

Remember I am a Capitalist - I only see pound notes

The customer can so easily be mislead

Apple Iphone 6 - what $700 -800 + I reckon proper selling price $250

Do you pay $10 for a loaf of bread - or $15 for bottled water ??

Other phone companies just love Apple - they keep all prices artificially high

The public are conned - but they still are happy with Apple's products

All good stuff -

The iPhone 6 with contract $199 plus $58 in CA sales tax on the $650. It cost me $257.00. I don't know where you bought yours. I do sometimes buy bread for $10 and I buy truffle gouda cheese for $44.95/lb, I also buy $33.95/lb mocetta. You get what you pay for. If you want to cheap stuff like $6.00/lb fish be forewarned.

Many people, including myself, think Apple is a great product regardless of the price. Starbucks is great for me. I support them mostly because of their ingenuity. I would still support it even if it cost $5.00 per cup.
 
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The state is government - you are anti governments - you only want free capitalism - with no controls - ie raw capitalism

Clarify if this in not the case ??

So, all this time you've been calling yourself a Capitalist and you don't even know what that is, right?
 
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