Best Thread Bund Bobl and Schatz Thread
Buy 'em,
Tried the Schatz today on simulator. Deep market - up to 20,000 on bid/offer. Started with 5-minute bar but later found 2-minute bars far better. Made a net 22 points trading from one contract and adding to position (up to 5) if was moving quickly in my favour. Made 42 net on Bobl. It's the rallies that keep catching me out on the wrong side.
Yesterday on the bobl was pretty good/transparent - any sell-off was countered immediately by buyers taking it up again with monotonous predictability. However, I reckoned it was only a matter of time before a sell-off turned into a (relative) rout. And it did, and I was caught. Such is life. A good day could have been better but I learned from this.
Let's see what happens tomorrow.
Good trading,
Grant.
Tried the Schatz today on simulator. Deep market - up to 20,000 on bid/offer. Started with 5-minute bar but later found 2-minute bars far better. Made a net 22 points trading from one contract and adding to position (up to 5) if was moving quickly in my favour. Made 42 net on Bobl. It's the rallies that keep catching me out on the wrong side.
Yesterday on the bobl was pretty good/transparent - any sell-off was countered immediately by buyers taking it up again with monotonous predictability. However, I reckoned it was only a matter of time before a sell-off turned into a (relative) rout. And it did, and I was caught. Such is life. A good day could have been better but I learned from this.
Let's see what happens tomorrow.
Good trading,
Grant.
trader_dante
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We don't have Bobl and Schatz on sim so it's just Bund for me. I did my **** today - sorry couldn't resist using that phrase. I've found it hilarious ever since one of the big Bund traders that sits behind me whimpered it during it the last US IR anouncement.
It so cool trading the Bund direct market. Before I got in at a prop firm I was spreadbetting it with a spread of 3 ticks!
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TD,
**** doesn't translate very well on T2W. Rearrange the letters and I'll work it out.
Can you get bobl and schatz on charts? If you can, it may be an idea to compare them with the bund. I would say the difference between the three is dependent on your time-frame. If it's intra-day/ scalping, the bund is the most volatile. Beyond an hour, I reckon the relative difference between the three (in volatility) is not that great.
The difference in absolute volatility is possbly due to the frequency/size of trades and depth of market - the bund trades more small sizes at a higher frequency but with the least depth; bobl trades larger sizes with less frequency but greater depth; schatz with even larger sizes with even less frequency but with the greatest depth. That said, the Scahtz is no picnic to scalp - it can still catch you out.
Grant.
**** doesn't translate very well on T2W. Rearrange the letters and I'll work it out.
Can you get bobl and schatz on charts? If you can, it may be an idea to compare them with the bund. I would say the difference between the three is dependent on your time-frame. If it's intra-day/ scalping, the bund is the most volatile. Beyond an hour, I reckon the relative difference between the three (in volatility) is not that great.
The difference in absolute volatility is possbly due to the frequency/size of trades and depth of market - the bund trades more small sizes at a higher frequency but with the least depth; bobl trades larger sizes with less frequency but greater depth; schatz with even larger sizes with even less frequency but with the greatest depth. That said, the Scahtz is no picnic to scalp - it can still catch you out.
Grant.
trader_dante
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LOL the word was slang for backside. Four letters, first one a and ending with e. hahaha!
What do you mean by depth?
Directional
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TD,
"Depth" refers to liquidity/total volume available on the bid and ask to the current 10 levels in my examples. See attachment.
The total volume figures are shown at the top of each table. Figures at extreme left of each table are last trades (red for sales, blue for buys). This is Time and Sales without the Time, so to speak.
Despite what I said above, the bobl today seems relatively shallow. Maybe I should re-check my figures.
Grant.
"Depth" refers to liquidity/total volume available on the bid and ask to the current 10 levels in my examples. See attachment.
The total volume figures are shown at the top of each table. Figures at extreme left of each table are last trades (red for sales, blue for buys). This is Time and Sales without the Time, so to speak.
Despite what I said above, the bobl today seems relatively shallow. Maybe I should re-check my figures.
Grant.
Good to see everyone enjoying the thread. Imo schatz is superior to both bund and bobl. I mean think about it. You can do as much size as you want, it lags the bund, is a little more sane then the rest of them. I actually like schatz for scalping 3 ticks the best. I find watching tick charts along with the orderbook is the best way to trade this market with size for 3 ticks.
Just finished up today and after closing the platform I think we are headed lower but thats just me. Had some huge size on the offers and paper was a seller as of late. Made some good money leaning on that size and flowing with paper. I think we could break through that trendline very soon and start heading lower from there today. We have overhead resistance on the 133 tick chart and we are coming to an apex in this market.
Good Trading Guys
Just finished up today and after closing the platform I think we are headed lower but thats just me. Had some huge size on the offers and paper was a seller as of late. Made some good money leaning on that size and flowing with paper. I think we could break through that trendline very soon and start heading lower from there today. We have overhead resistance on the 133 tick chart and we are coming to an apex in this market.
Good Trading Guys
Leaning on size refers to stepping in front of a big bid or offer. If I see 3000 lots in the schatz sitting on the offer and every time somebody buys a few at that level there are always offers replenishing that level (sign of a real offer not a spoof) then I will step in front of it. So if the offer is at 44 I will offer 43 asuming that at the present time the market will not be able to break through 44 if I get filled. A lot more than that goes into it but that is the basic idea.
Watching the orderbook is one of the best ways to make money imo. Watch, Watch, Watch the orderbook and look for patterns.
Have a good weekend guys.
Watching the orderbook is one of the best ways to make money imo. Watch, Watch, Watch the orderbook and look for patterns.
Have a good weekend guys.
dont think u can lean on on any bid or offer in the schatz under my opinion the vast majority of the market is manipulated by 1-2 massive guys. same in bobl. anything above 2000 in shatz has a big percentage of flipping. i ve heard scalping days in schatz are over
Well you heard wrong. Lots of money to be made scalping the book in bund bobl and yes even schatz. Its true these markets are dominated by a few big players (I know the 2 you are probably talking about personally). All markets are usually dominated by a few larger players though.
Obviously you don't want to be stepping infront of big bids/offers randomly, it is a little more complicated than that. It takes time and skill to prefect it but once you know half way what you are doing you will find that it isn't hard but it sure as hell isn't easy! :cheesy:
I looked at my charts very little today and most of all my trading was off of the book and I just finished up with one of my better days I have ever had!
Hope everyone is having a good trading day!
trader_dante
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Right, it's IFO up in 40 minutes.
The rumour is of 101 which is considerably lower which should therefore be positive for Bunds.
Buying coming in on the Bunds now as traders position for this possibly lower report.
I think the best way to play this is to look for it to come in higher which will force all longs to cover and all those on the sidelines to go short.
Should be good for a few ticks.
Opinions?
The rumour is of 101 which is considerably lower which should therefore be positive for Bunds.
Buying coming in on the Bunds now as traders position for this possibly lower report.
I think the best way to play this is to look for it to come in higher which will force all longs to cover and all those on the sidelines to go short.
Should be good for a few ticks.
Opinions?
trader_dante
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Directional
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and still running lower!
