Brexit - Will it be ratified?

[NickBk]

! can't argue with figures and admit that there is a big case for proportional representation.

However, UKIP only has 2 seats and SNP 59 and that is the way things are, at least, until the next elections

Banging the drum for PR may be the way for UKIP to win more seats, they have no other policies, or leaders, at the moment, and they need both.

As for discussing the merits of each others intelligence, I'll pass on that, but here is a photo of me. :smart:

Again, for the last time, for your smiley friend too, where did I refer to parties?

My point was but I am past caring, is if fringe players are considered then surely UKIP represent more people (not seats) who have an interest in the outcome. The SNP are way less representative of the total electorate for Brexit.

What is difficult here?

 

[Splitlink]

Are you implying that the Remain camp didn't do the same ? This is the latest accusation by a Remain supporter.

Turkey military coup 'caused by BREXIT', claims Labour MP

A lot of rubbish has been said by both sides. The reason is that no one knows what is going to happen. It remains for both sides to pick up the pieces, put them together, or put them in the garbage, and move on.

 

[counter_violent]

Are you implying that the Remain camp didn't do the same ? This is the latest accusation by a Remain supporter.

Turkey military coup 'caused by BREXIT', claims Labour MP

You should see his twitter page

https://twitter.com/RhonddaBryant?lang=en-gb

 

[Splitlink]

Again, for the last time, for your smiley friend too, where did I refer to parties?

My point was but I am past caring, is if fringe players are considered then surely UKIP represent more people (not seats) who have an interest in the outcome. The SNP are way less representative of the total electorate for Brexit.

What is difficult here?

My post, 242, was in answer to your post 241.

It's not that important to this thread. Let's move on

 

[Atilla]

Reality check!

This one is for you Nick! Fringe article... sort of
Theresa May to meet Nicola Sturgeon for Brexit talks in first visit as Prime Minister

This one is for you Sparky! One of your fav newspapers
Theresa May suggests Brexit delay as she says no Article 50 until Scotland gives go-ahead


That's how important Scotland and the Union is.

I think fringe parties could do well forming coalition with the Minions. They are also looking for a new Master to lead them somewhere

 

[Atilla]

Are you implying that the Remain camp didn't do the same ? This is the latest accusation by a Remain supporter.

Turkey military coup 'caused by BREXIT', claims Labour MP

Well it depends who bought what?

I thought Osborne was dreadful with the stupid assessments of austerity and WW3 claims. But they were assessments and largely they were so outlandish nobody bought them.

So were, school places, hospital resources, rise in wages and jobs all over the country whilst cutting back migrant numbers.

Said this before, the Brexit campaign was excellent. They told people what they wanted to hear and how wonderful everyone was, that we have faith in them all and we can all do sooo much better.

One set of lies and deceit stuck and the other forecasts and assessments whilst true in some respects were so incredibly far fetched did not.

Neither makes a Brexit a fair call. This is why government must carry out indepth analysis of identifying whether UK interests greater in or out and not leave it to politicians.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Apply due diligence and good practice on approach to a a very very BIG question.


Sorry, we won't stop migrants! Brexit MEP 'rows back on claims that quitting the EU would cut immigration' in furious BBC clash
Daniel Hannan spoke to Newsnight presenter Evan Davis about leaving
Said Britain must agree to freedom of movement to access single market
Comes as Farage rowed back on claims £350m would go back into NHS
Davis accused campaign of misleading public when speaking to Hannan


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...igration-furious-BBC-clash.html#ixzz4EbL9U6NS
Follow us: @mailonline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

 

[Signalcalc]

Well it depends who bought what?

I thought Osborne was dreadful with the stupid assessments of austerity and WW3 claims. But they were assessments and largely they were so outlandish nobody bought them.

So were, school places, hospital resources, rise in wages and jobs all over the country whilst cutting back migrant numbers.

Said this before, the Brexit campaign was excellent. They told people what they wanted to hear and how wonderful everyone was, that we have faith in them all and we can all do sooo much better.

One set of lies and deceit stuck and the other forecasts and assessments whilst true in some respects were so incredibly far fetched did not.

Neither makes a Brexit a fair call. This is why government must carry out indepth analysis of identifying whether UK interests greater in or out and not leave it to politicians.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Apply due diligence and good practice on approach to a a very very BIG question.


Sorry, we won't stop migrants! Brexit MEP 'rows back on claims that quitting the EU would cut immigration' in furious BBC clash
Daniel Hannan spoke to Newsnight presenter Evan Davis about leaving
Said Britain must agree to freedom of movement to access single market
Comes as Farage rowed back on claims £350m would go back into NHS
Davis accused campaign of misleading public when speaking to Hannan


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...igration-furious-BBC-clash.html#ixzz4EbL9U6NS
Follow us: @mailonline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

I think this just proves that people voted with their gut feelings rather than listening to the peddled crap from both sides.

It just so happens that more people had a gut feeling for leaving than remaining.

No-one wins, but everyone wins.

 

[samfarrell]

Look, The UK needs access to single market. End of
It wont get that without agreeing on free movement of people and immigration.
I dont see what possible agreement could be reached on this basis
My gut feeling is that the government will back down on free movement and immigration in order to maintain access to the market.

 

[Atilla]

Look, The UK needs access to single market. End of
It wont get that without agreeing on free movement of people and immigration.
I dont see what possible agreement could be reached on this basis
My gut feeling is that the government will back down on free movement and immigration in order to maintain access to the market.

That indeed is the crux of it.

However, the exercised needs to be performed to demonstrate to the public, the options and choices available to them and at what cost!

David Davis, the new minister for Brexit, believes it will be possible to secure bilateral trade deals with the rest of the world that are larger than the value of the EU single market within two years. He also believes that tariff-free access to the EU single market can be negotiated for the UK because it is in the self-interest of the UK, and the EU. His preferred model is the recently struck Canadian comprehensive and economic trade agreement (Ceta).


Feasibility and viability of these propositions need to be examined and verified.

Exciting times ahead. So far so good with low pound to help exports and new heroes in government to make it happen.

By hook or crook we've arrived at a very good position if I may say so my self - give or take a few uncertainties. Should help keep the Europeans on their toes too.

I'm feeling well optimistic but sadly markets may be getting ready to tank! Who knows??? :whistling

 

[counter_violent]

That indeed is the crux of it.

However, the exercised needs to be performed to demonstrate to the public, the options and choices available to them and at what cost!

David Davis, the new minister for Brexit, believes it will be possible to secure bilateral trade deals with the rest of the world that are larger than the value of the EU single market within two years. He also believes that tariff-free access to the EU single market can be negotiated for the UK because it is in the self-interest of the UK, and the EU. His preferred model is the recently struck Canadian comprehensive and economic trade agreement (Ceta).


Feasibility and viability of these propositions need to be examined and verified.

Exciting times ahead. So far so good with low pound to help exports and new heroes in government to make it happen.

By hook or crook we've arrived at a very good position if I may say so my self - give or take a few uncertainties. Should help the Europeans on their toes too.

I'm feeling well optimistic but sadly markets may be getting ready to tank! Who knows??? :whistling

And as I keep telling you, and as David Davis is now also telling you. The UK does not need to accept the free movement of peoples in order to secure a deal with the EU. He also says that we should forge ahead and do deals outside the EU. This is negotiating from a position of strength. Individual European countries need the UK more than we need them. Got it yet ?

Funny isn't it, that the more successful players are the fringe players, like Switzerland, Norway etc, who's economies are doing very nicely by staying on the fringe Also, because they are doing ok, the EU wants to impose free movement upon them !

The EU is hopeless and I can't wait for it all to come crashing down.

Have a lovely weekend xxxxxx

 

[Oscar Reed]

Agree strongly Splitlink, re: Turkey is not fit for EU and especially even more so with its current system of democracy and religious figure head nutter in charge. Surprised to see coup in Turkey and it just goes to show what level they have reached. I suspect Cameron is right and it will take them a few generations to move on from them barking up the remnants of the Ottoman empire. Year 3000 sounds about right.

Also agree about the union which should be cherished and preserved. Very happy to see Theresa in control. All the right moves and correct approach in dealing with this momentous decision which ever way it moves, subject to detailed, indepth analysis of all due considerations taken into account.

Needless to say we should consider views of all UK players on not just fringe players like UKIP who have skewed opinion with false promises that can't be delivered without serious cost implications.

Yes England can survive and prevail outside of EU but will the outcome be better or worse for the UK?

Big question to answer in due course without the lies and deceit of politicians but one based on detailed study on impact to the UK.

Jee Theresa May gets the Atilla approval.

That must mean the kiss of death.

 

[counter_violent]

I know we have already left but I do like to remind myself why we left.

 

[Splitlink]

That indeed is the crux of it.

However, the exercised needs to be performed to demonstrate to the public, the options and choices available to them and at what cost!

David Davis, the new minister for Brexit, believes it will be possible to secure bilateral trade deals with the rest of the world that are larger than the value of the EU single market within two years. He also believes that tariff-free access to the EU single market can be negotiated for the UK because it is in the self-interest of the UK, and the EU. His preferred model is the recently struck Canadian comprehensive and economic trade agreement (Ceta).


Feasibility and viability of these propositions need to be examined and verified.

Exciting times ahead. So far so good with low pound to help exports and new heroes in government to make it happen.

By hook or crook we've arrived at a very good position if I may say so my self - give or take a few uncertainties. Should help keep the Europeans on their toes too.

I'm feeling well optimistic but sadly markets may be getting ready to tank! Who knows??? :whistling

Knowing what I know from Brussels and Spanish politics, if there is a deadline date they will go right up to the very last day to agree. They always do. So, if the gut feeling that you have is correct be prepared for good old patience with plenty of repetition in the media, for all of the two years. All over one stupid, tantalising, point. Then everyone will agree, after working until midnight, and go home for a well earned holliday,. We are used to it.

Now and again, there will be a terrorist attack, or a plane crash, or floods, just to break the monotony a bit.

 

[Splitlink]

Nigel Farage is on LBC, this morning.

 

[Trader333]

Well it depends who bought what?

Exactly, it seems that no one bought anything. You had a three main party campaign plus celebrities and others and it just didn't work. It was not because anyone believed the Out camp in my view and the most recent poll showed that the result would be the same now as it was three weeks ago.

What it shows is that "facts" whether true or based on promises / lies were irrelevant in the campaign and the reason the result was Out was based on other factors some of which have been brewing for a long time. From what I can see people had made their mind up before the campaign even started.

 

[Atilla]

Exactly, it seems that no one bought anything. You had a three main party campaign plus celebrities and others and it just didn't work. It was not because anyone believed the Out camp in my view and the most recent poll showed that the result would be the same now as it was three weeks ago.

What it shows is that "facts" whether true or based on promises / lies were irrelevant in the campaign and the reason the result was Out was based on other factors some of which have been brewing for a long time. From what I can see people had made their mind up before the campaign even started.

It would not be accurate to reach that conclusion.


Across 70m people there are always those who will have an opinion and those who don't and some undecided.

So the latter two section of people will have made up their minds based on the campaign.

So whilst large % of the pop. may have made up their mind before campaign but some during and some towards the very end.


Considering the win margin was so close the campaign will have had a significant difference with the don't knows and undecideds making up their minds.

 

[piphoe]

occasionally they televise your parliament in action...i really enjoy watching.

actual laughter at clever remark, and affirmative nods by party members. and standing "here here".

very civil, with an occasional fist fight..good fun

so much different than my senate/house. mine are so anal and dour...

 

[samfarrell]

Nigel Farage is on LBC, this morning.

He will be a sort of celebrity now i guess. A hero to many

 

[Atilla]

He will be a sort of celebrity now i guess. A hero to many

Much like what Blair trumpeted at the time back in 2003.


Blair: History will be my judge


Let's give Nigel 10 years to see the fruits of his labour. Bated breath n all that...

 

[Pat494]

Nicola Sturgeon has suggested she has a veto over when Britain leaves the European Union, in comments that will infuriate Right-wing ministers in charge of Brexit.

Scotland’s First Minister conceded that she can dictate the timing of a British exit from the EU in an interview on BBC1’s The Andrew Marr Show.

Asked if she had a “veto in her back pocket” about when Britain leaves the EU, she replied: “I think we are in a very strong position. That is a position that I am going to use as well as I can.”

Her comments came after Liam Fox, the new International Trade Secretary, and David Davis, the new Brexit Secretary, said they wanted Britain to start formal exit talks by the end of this year.

On Friday, Theresa May indicated that Brexit could be delayed as she said she would not start the formal process for leaving the EU until there is a "UK approach" backed by Scotland.

In a sign that the new Prime Minister was committed to keeping the Union intact, Mrs May said she would not trigger Article 50 - the formal process for withdrawing from the EU - until all the devolved nations in the country agree.

Her comments could prompt anger among EU leaders, who want Mrs May to invoke Article 50 immediately.

Speaking in Edinburgh, Mrs May said: "I have already said that I won't be triggering Article 50 until I think that we have a UK approach and objectives for negotiations.

“I think it is important that we establish that before we trigger Article 50.”

Key questions | Scotland and Brexit

Does Scotland want Britain to leave the EU?

No. Northern Ireland and Scotland are the UK’s most pro-EU regions with almost 62% of people in Scotland and 55% in Northern Ireland voting to remain.

Will Brexit lead to Scotland leaving the UK?

It has certainly raised new questions about independence in Scotland and could force Scots to consider whether they want to be in the British union or the European union.

What has pro-Remain Nicola Sturgeon said about it?

Nicola Sturgeon said a second independence referendum is “highly likely” in the next two-and-a-half years following UK’s vote to leave the EU. At a press conference at Bute House, her official residence in Edinburgh, where she was flanked by the Saltire and the EU flag, she said that it was "democratically unacceptable" for Scotland to be taken out of the EU against its will. Every part of the country voted to remain, and she said her government would now begin preparing legislation to enable another independence vote if the Scottish Parliament decided it was appropriate. The last battle to keep Scotland in the union was fought less than two years ago. Supporters of independence were defeated, winning 45pc of the vote.

What does the Scottish arm of Vote Leave say?

They say Brexit will mean Scottish voters will have far more freedom to control fisheries, farming and health policy.