Anyone still uses James16 Price Action?

[DionysusToast]

Maybe, maybe not. Doesn't matter really. For those inclined they give a reason to trade and it's how you manage that trade that's much more important than what prompted you to enter in the first place.

My experience with pin bars in the guise of hammers or shooting stars (as the potential swing low/high points in the retracements I trade) is enough to have me entering with a double position. I luv 'em

So you are suggesting that you can enter a trade with no discernible edge at entry and manage edge into the trade?

When you double your position based on a pin bar, does it not bother you that this is a completely random event? That if the close of the bar was second or minutes earlier that you would enter a normal size position?

 

[barjon]

So you are suggesting that you can enter a trade with no discernible edge at entry and manage edge into the trade?

When you double your position based on a pin bar, does it not bother you that this is a completely random event? That if the close of the bar was second or minutes earlier that you would enter a normal size position?

Not quite, but I believe risk and trade management to be by far the most important.

Remember I'm trading off the daily bar and thus the pin-bar represents a true trading session and not a random slice of time.

 

[barjon]

....oh! And just to set your pulses racing here's the famous March 2009 monthly pin-bar that came at the end of the last bear market

 

[neil]

....oh! And just to set your pulses racing here's the famous March 2009 monthly pin-bar that came at the end of the last bear market

Where's me beta blockers

 

[DionysusToast]

Not quite, but I believe risk and trade management to be by far the most important.

Remember I'm trading off the daily bar and thus the pin-bar represents a true trading session and not a random slice of time.

So if a market went aggresively south one day and then the next day it we t aggresively North all day, that would not be as good an opportunity as one that reversed at lunchtime? The latter forming a pin bar and the former not...

Any particular reason for that?

 

[barjon]

So if a market went aggresively south one day and then the next day it we t aggresively North all day, that would not be as good an opportunity as one that reversed at lunchtime? The latter forming a pin bar and the former not...

Any particular reason for that?

No difference, really, except for timing - but then no-one's suggesting that pin-bars are the ONLY means of depicting such market action.

 

[DionysusToast]

No difference, really, except for timing - but then no-one's suggesting that pin-bars are the ONLY means of depicting such market action.

No difference but you would double your size on the trade?

 

[barjon]

No difference but you would double your size on the trade?

Only because of observation that whenever the final bar in a retracement was a pin-bar I'd been getting in excess of 80% success over a 12 month period (not a huge number of pin-bars, though). That was significant enough to try double size, which I still do since it continues to be worthwhile in a greater level of success than the norm.

Pin bars are starkly obvious and it maybe that the same type of market action not showing up in the same way would be equally successful - I don't know because I've never looked.

 

[Trader333]

Any particular reason for that?

In my view yes there is and that is because there are a lot of traders who always go flat at the end of the day. I agree that pinbars during the day are of limited value but EOD and they have more significance when combined with other factors. Not that I trade them as I don't but I can see why they would be of more value for EOD traders.

 

[barjon]

toastie

As a matter of interest here are the pin-bars on RBS for the last couple of months. I picked RBS because it's on my watch list for entry on Monday.

The whites all triggered and had potential; the yellows didn't trigger; the bluey was the only loser; the pinkie might well have been a loser unless you were sharp; and the open white remains to be seen.

I don't believe you, toastie, couldn't have come out on top with that lot - I didn't trade them, of course

ps: missed the first one or two - the chart shifted in the copying!!

 

[DionysusToast]

toastie

As a matter of interest here are the pin-bars on RBS for the last couple of months. I picked RBS because it's on my watch list for entry on Monday.

The whites all triggered and had potential; the yellows didn't trigger; the bluey was the only loser; the pinkie might well have been a loser unless you were sharp; and the open white remains to be seen.

I don't believe you, toastie, couldn't have come out on top with that lot - I didn't trade them, of course

ps: missed the first one or two - the chart shifted in the copying!!

Now circle the ones that didn't work out...

 

[barjon]

Now circle the ones that didn't work out...

i've done that - there was only the one and one maybe unless you were quick

 

[DionysusToast]

In my view yes there is and that is because there are a lot of traders who always go flat at the end of the day. I agree that pinbars during the day are of limited value but EOD and they have more significance when combined with other factors. Not that I trade them as I don't but I can see why they would be of more value for EOD traders.

On days where the majority of traders are intraday traders - the open, high, low, close is largely irrelevant.

 

[DionysusToast]

i've done that - there was only the one and one maybe unless you were quick

I think you may have missed some...

Red arrows - shorts, blue arrows long.... Just highlighting the ones there that would most likely have failed

1 to 7 all look like failures to me. 1 is a little more hazy but I presume loser because of the volatility probably shaking you out

 

[barjon]

I think you may have missed some...

Red arrows - shorts, blue arrows long.... Just highlighting the ones there that would most likely have failed

1 to 7 all look like failures to me. 1 is a little more hazy but I presume loser because of the volatility probably shaking you out

From the left:
1st RED arrow - don't see how a short failed
1st BLUE arrow - the admitted failure.
2nd BLUE arrow - it wouldn't have triggered long (no move above pin-bar high)
2nd RED arrow - it wouldn't have triggered short (no move below pb low)
3rd RED arrow - it wouldn't have triggered short (ditto)
4th RED arrow - not a pin bar (not at new high)
Black arrow - we'll see

ps: 3rd BLUE arrow - aye, that's one I missed that would have likely lost.

 

[neil]

Pin bars are not traded on their own (I have said this before). Location and previous price action has to be taken into account. Barjon has already hinted at those pins likely to succeed and I suspect he probably knows why. This does not mean every one is a winner -no approach in trading is a winner every time. Hence the need for stops/targets and a disciplined mind set. I will agree to disagree with others here and wish you well with whatever approach to the markets that you find profitable.

 

[trader_dante]

Didn't Dante admit that he started his James16 related threads on T2W teaching people about pin bars when he wasn't making any money himself?

No. Utter rubbish. But don't start telling the truth now and change the habit of a life time ;-)

 

[NVP]

hey TD

good to see you ....hows it going ?

N

 

[ffsear]

Pin Bars give us an idea about market sentiment, but that as far as they go for me. I don't like using them for entries. And I think the process of entering a trade on a pin break, and having your stop just past the tail is a risky one! They don't define market limits

 

[barjon]

Pin Bars give us an idea about market sentiment, but that as far as they go for me. I don't like using them for entries. And I think the process of entering a trade on a pin break, and having your stop just past the tail is a risky one! They don't define market limits

mmm, the rationale of a pin-bar is that there has been a strong rejection of a low (high) point with some momentum behind it. It is assumed that momentum will carry on. If it starts going wrong once you are in then that momentum has been lost and the the rationale for the trade has disappeared. To wait looking for a turnaround before your stop below (above) the tail is hit now relies on hope.