Anyone find trading isolating?

[robster970]

Hi Robster - you're right good trading method and good mm should = no blow up.
I was just saying that until thats been done consistently its not proven - human nature or whatever else intervening. Of the 95% of failures I bet many are fairly successful for quite long periods until they make a slip and blow their account.

I can imagine that overindulgent risk taking and aggressive compounding leading to a lot of problems particularly as complacency takes over and the markets wipe you out in some weird turn of events.

 

[Marwan2010]

Hello


Everything has taken a backfoot - The gym, my mates, hobbies, family, girlfriend, holidays, passing my driving test, i haven't been drinking to avoid the next day being hungover and not being able to perform.

x Laugh all u like ^^

Great Post!
I too have been there, done it, made it, blown it! and done it again
have had to sacrifice alot in life to become a trader.

I do earn a good living now, not having to go to work, my own boss!
no work politics!

I love it!

I am always around for my family! and my kids
i have NOW got life after trading

if you ask me in the evening what did GU did, i literally go blank?

 

[Rossini]

Exactly. It is hard to take someone seriously when they say they have dedicated 6 months of their life to this and have finally become profitable. I am not saying that it's impossible to do, maybe if you are a prodigy, but it is just impossible to believe.

Ask someone who has repeatedly failed there driving test (and has been trying for years) if they think driving can be taught to a competent level within 6 months? Its more than likely that they will reply 'no'.

 

[Vaco]

Ask someone who has repeatedly failed there driving test (and has been trying for years) if they think driving can be taught to a competent level within 6 months? Its more than likely that they will reply 'no'.

You may have learned how to drive in 6 months but that does not mean that you will not have a major accident in the next 2 years.

Halo feels he has done an intensive course and passed, now he has to prove he can avoid writing off his car(account) or even better avoid having a major accident(drawdown) all together.

As for the depressed whinging i'm lonely and sacrificed too much attitude, grow up life's full of sacrifice and there's no room for regrets, just reflect and adapt.

 

[Black Swan]

Exactly. It is hard to take someone seriously when they say they have dedicated 6 months of their life to this and have finally become profitable. I am not saying that it's impossible to do, maybe if you are a prodigy, but it is just impossible to believe.

Can't agree with you on this, plenty of live examples; for example in Dan Arm's (all about the pips journal thread) FX club there are plenty of guys and gals who are making very good pips on a daily basis and consistently profitbale, having very few bad (losing) days. Most are new (brand new) to trading.

There is a profile however, most appear to be quite mature, at a guess I'd say 30 to 35+, perhaps that has something to do with the level of success, together with the fact that the level of instruction helps them avoid a lot of the usual pitfalls..not selling it for Dan, I only contributed for a couple of months as it didn't fit in with my trading methods or times.

 

[new_trader]

Ask someone who has repeatedly failed there driving test (and has been trying for years) if they think driving can be taught to a competent level within 6 months? Its more than likely that they will reply 'no'.

I'm not sure if you are agreeing? I would say that most people in this forum who have been at this game for more than 3 years will identify with the 38 steps to being a successful trader. To think that you are 'successful' after 6 months means that even if you studied 7 days/week and every month had 31 days, you spent on average of 4.89 days at each stage. Do you think this sounds right?

I'd say Halo is at stage 13 or 23 or 27 or 33, but not 38...no way!

1.We accumulate trading information - buying books, going to seminars and researching.

2.We begin to trade with our 'new' knowledge.

3.We consistently 'donate' and then realize we may need more knowledge or information.

4.We accumulate more information.

5.We switch the commodities we are currently following.

6.We go back into the market and trade with our 'updated' knowledge.

7.We get 'beat up' again and begin to lose some of our confidence. Fear starts setting in.
8.We start to listen to 'outside news' & other traders.
9. We go back into the market and continue to donate.
10. We switch commodities again.
11. We search for more trading information.
12. We go back into the market and continue to donate.
13. We get 'overconfident' & market humbles us.
14. We start to understand that trading success fully is going to take more time and more knowledge then we anticipated.
________________________________________

Many Traders Will Give up at this Point as
they Realize Work is Involved
15. We get serious and start concentrating on learning a 'real' methodology.
16. We trade our methodology with some success, but realize that something is missing.
17. We begin to understand the need for having rules to apply our methodology.
18. We take a sabbatical from trading to develop and research our trading rules.
19. We start trading again, this time with rules and find some success, but overall we still hesitate when it comes time to execute. We start trading again, this time with rules and find some success, but overall we still hesitate when it comes time to execute.
20. We add, subtract and modify rules as we see a need to be more proficient with our rules.
21. We go back into the market and continue to donate. We go back into the market and continue to donate.
22. We start to take responsibility for our trading results as we understand that our success is in us, not the trade methodology.
23. We continue to trade and become more proficient with our methodology and our rules.
24. As we trade we still have a tendency to violate our rules and our results are erratic.
25. We know we are close.
26. We go back and research our rules.
27. We build the confidence in our rules and go back into the market and trade.
28. Our trading results are getting better, but we are still hesitating in executing our rules.
29. We now see the importance of following our rules as we see the results of our trades when we don't follow them.
30. We begin to see that our lack of success is within us (a lack of discipline in following the rules because of some kind of fear) and we begin to work on knowing ourselves better.
31. We continue to trade and the market teaches us more and more about ourselves.
32. We master our methodology and trading rules.
33. We begin to consistently make money. We begin to consistently make money.
34. We get a little overconfident and the market humbles us.
35. We continue to learn our lessons.
36. We stop thinking and allow our rules to trade for us (trading becomes boring, but successful) and our trading account continues to grow as we increase our contract size.
37. We are making more money then we ever dreamed to be possible.
38. We go on with our lives and accomplish many of the goals we had always dreamed of.

 

[Rossini]

You may have learned how to drive in 6 months but that does not mean that you will not have a major accident in the next 2 years.

Halo feels he has done an intensive course and passed, now he has to prove he can avoid writing off his car(account) or even better avoid having a major accident(drawdown) all together.

Good post, but I think less emphasis should be placed on not blowing up. If he has a good plan and feels he has the discipline to stick to it then there should be no reason to blow up. Even if he fails to make any money the fact that he is sticking to his plan and not making money should tell him there is something wrong well before he blows up.

Blowing up is for people without a plan in my view.

 

[new_trader]

Can't agree with you on this, plenty of live examples; for example in Dan Arm's (all about the pips journal thread) FX club there are plenty of guys and gals who are making very good pips on a daily basis and consistently profitbale, having very few bad (losing) days. Most are new (brand new) to trading.

There is a profile however, most appear to be quite mature, at a guess I'd say 30 to 35+, perhaps that has something to do with the level of success, together with the fact that the level of instruction helps them avoid a lot of the usual pitfalls..not selling it for Dan, I only contributed for a couple of months as it didn't fit in with my trading methods or times.

Don't be a sucker. Read this thread in 3 years time and see if you agree...such an innocent child.

 

[Black Swan]

Don't be a sucker. Read this thread in 3 years time and see if you agree...such an innocent child.

at 44 I must be the "man with the child in his eyes"....in the Kate Bush song sense not Gary Glitter
NT I'll ask this as 'politely' as I can, but are you a person who suffers from depression?

 

[HaloTrader]

I can't see any reason that i'd blow up my account.
I have strict money management, i have a strict methodology for entries, stop loss and exit, i have good statistical risk:reward ratio, my emotions do not affect my trading i always take every trade that i am signalled, and i have a very structured plan to increase my trade sizing, i don't hold overnight positions, i always have automatic stop losses and limit targets and i also have a rule that i think most people don't which is that i only trade 75% of my account anyway,

So my trading capital 25% sits in the bank and the 75% becomes my 100% and i risk 1% on this per trade. This is to ensure that if a blow up were to occur i would have backup money to continue, not that i will blow up, personally i know it won't happen. In my head it feels impossible to blow up.

New Trader - In a lot of ways i cannot relate to that 38 rules, in a lot of ways i can. Since i started trading, the first day i lost £100 and since then i've realy been quite consistant and haven't 'donated' much at all, and its not beginners luck because i do actually know what i'm talking about in trading and i'm a very quick learner. I've seen some people on here take years to learn to trade and understand everything but i've just picked it up fast. Anyway, thats not what this discussion was about ^^

x

 

[Vaco]

Halo,

true the discussion seems to have taken a diversion so lets get back on track,

The time you have spent learning to trade properly has saved you hundreds of £ if not thousands, do you still think that it was time not well spent?

 

[Vaco]

Good post, but I think less emphasis should be placed on not blowing up. If he has a good plan and feels he has the discipline to stick to it then there should be no reason to blow up. Even if he fails to make any money the fact that he is sticking to his plan and not making money should tell him there is something wrong well before he blows up.

Blowing up is for people without a plan in my view.

Its when the going gets tough that we start to question our plan and how we react that defines us, only time will tell how anyone will react to a 10+ losing streak and the doubts that creap in to their mind when it happens.

Does the system still work, has the market changed, Should I tweak it, should i scale down or scale up.... the list goes on and on.

 

[foredog]

It can be isolating working from home. That's possibly why many of us end up on here, contact with the outside world!!

but then no more isolating than maybe a long distance lorry driver or train driver. At least we can go out to the gym if we choose, if the mkts dead.

Also once you've finished that immersion version of learning you can restrict yourself to the hours that best suit your chosen markets and the rest of the times your own.

 

[keano]

New Trader - In a lot of ways i cannot relate to that 38 rules, in a lot of ways i can. Since i started trading, the first day i lost £100 and since then i've realy been quite consistant and haven't 'donated' much at all, and its not beginners luck because i do actually know what i'm talking about in trading and i'm a very quick learner. I've seen some people on here take years to learn to trade and understand everything but i've just picked it up fast. Anyway, thats not what this discussion was about ^^

x

lol

 

[Technically Fundamental]

IMO 6 months isn't enough time to learn any 'profession' at all. All my learning has told me you wont meet the criteria of being consistently profitable and making lucrative trades until you have years of experience. All depends on where you want to go in your trading though. You can dip your toe in the water or you can go swim in the ocean.

 

[HaloTrader]

Rofl... I feel slightly worried that my 4 month consistancy is going to some how disappear now :S
I can't see how i will suddenly start losing, the market may change but what i'm using is massively backtested and i have other ideas.... I've already been tested and had 11 losers in a row at 2% of my account risk - Kept going

We will see i suppose x

 

[Rossini]

Dont listen to all these guys who tell you it carnt be done, they just carnt do it. But it can be done. Keep your head on your shoulders and dont get cocky!

 

[montmorencyt2w]

Halo,

FWIW, when I was your age (red flags in front of motor cars had just been phased out), I seemed to spend most of my "spare" time, slogging away at my A levels, and still got crap results anyway (working hard, but not smart, and probably at the wrong subjects, but that's another story).

I lacked balance, and maybe you do a bit, too. However, at least you are seeing some benefit for your efforts. You just now have to keep a grip and not let it go to your head, and realise that you may have "passed your test", but as anyone who passes a driving test will tell you, you don't start learning how to drive until after that point. To use a very old fashioned expression, you've got to "get some in" (service, experience, whatever).

I believe you when you say you are a quick learner. Some people take to certain things quicker than others, and so far, you seem to have capitalised on this; well done. But it's not the last chapter in the training manual.

 

[Black Swan]

Rofl... I feel slightly worried that my 4 month consistancy is going to some how disappear now :S
I can't see how i will suddenly start losing, the market may change but what i'm using is massively backtested and i have other ideas.... I've already been tested and had 11 losers in a row at 2% of my account risk - Kept going

We will see i suppose x

I'd agree wtih this, although on occasion I do have to re-remind myself of the facts that my losses are always tiny, if I stick to the plan it is impossilbe for me to lose. I reckon you've got it sussed, just keep on going. There's a lot of negativity on 'ere, havn't quite worked out why yet...

 

[foredog]

if I stick to the plan it is impossilbe for me to lose.

Got to beware though that at some point the markets may change and your plan may not be so effective and your edge may reduce.


It's never impossible to lose so necessary to monitor for changes etc.
(not meant as a dig, just my view)