$500 to $5,000 per day DayTrading

[The Leopard]

Relax. It's just a discussion and let's be clear I'm not claiming anything. I'm a participant on this forum just like everyone else, all i'm doing is presenting information I have gathered and hold no opinion whatsoever on his proposed methods.

He's phone number and contact details are visible on his site for all to see, so you can always call him yourself.

This isn't a matter of opinion, as you'll discover if you decide to set light to 15 g-sheets.

I take it then that you haven't asked him why he sells training when he (allegedly) makes in excess of a million dollars a year from trading?

 

[jini]

That's a valid question and I'm sure you'll get an answer if you ask him. I'm more interested in hearing from any students about their experiences, whether they be negative or positive.

 

[The Leopard]

That's a valid question and I'm sure you'll get an answer if you ask him. I'm more interested in hearing from any students about their experiences, whether they be negative or positive.

Oh, I'm sure I'll get an answer .

But you shouldn't be more interested in his students at this stage. Can you really not see how crucial the question is?

But if you want to hear from his students, I'm sure some are available. I'm sure some of his "students" can tell you about all the "money" they are "making" "using" "his" "methods".

 

[jini]

OK then.. your right it's a scam. This doesn't seem to be too productive. I thought we might be able to have a interesting discussion about what his possible methods could be and for educational purposes dissect some strategies instead of taking the obvious route of flamming, that would be too easy. I guess there's no room here for anything else.

all the best.

 

[adrian2012]

You misunderstand me. Jini needs to run a mile from this, for obvious reasons. That's what I mean when I say that the facts are clear.

There is no doubt about it. 15 grand is about to go down the crapper.

Not sure who misunderstands whom My point is that Jini doesn't have facts yet, so she cannot judge them either way, good or bad.

There could be a counterpoint to not believing him. What if the guy is brilliant and has really found a system that gives you a high probability of winning. Not bulletproof, as none exist.

For me personally, the toughest argument against his system is the "big" question that was already raised here: "why teach others when he can quietly make his own millions and enjoy life". Why waste time speaking to people on the phone and coaching them, when he can travel around the world and spend money knowing that more is coming?

IF he had a valid reason to do it (e.g. some people seek celebrity status), I would understand why he would want to get paid in advance and why he is not cheap.

Without facts on the table, I would not spend that kind of money. But "seeing is believing", so if anyone can help ...

 

[jini]

at the risk of re-entering the fray, your thinking makes alot of sense Adrian. So to answer your questions without bias or judgment I can say he had tears running down his face when he presented his story, if anyone takes the time to read through his site or better still meet him in person it will be made abundantly clear why he is teaching others. It's more than money for this guy, which I know for some people here is difficult to understand.

So again.. I'm not saying I'm a believer and am sure not gulliable by nature but just curious enough from what I've seen to take the time to discuss it.

 

[DionysusToast]

Not sure who misunderstands whom My point is that Jini doesn't have facts yet, so she cannot judge them either way, good or bad.

There could be a counterpoint to not believing him. What if the guy is brilliant and has really found a system that gives you a high probability of winning. Not bulletproof, as none exist.

For me personally, the toughest argument against his system is the "big" question that was already raised here: "why teach others when he can quietly make his own millions and enjoy life". Why waste time speaking to people on the phone and coaching them, when he can travel around the world and spend money knowing that more is coming?

IF he had a valid reason to do it (e.g. some people seek celebrity status), I would understand why he would want to get paid in advance and why he is not cheap.

Without facts on the table, I would not spend that kind of money. But "seeing is believing", so if anyone can help ...

He's already laid the system out.

Trade both ways, take a profit on the one trade and hold the other hoping it comes back.

Then add in some options.

This will be high probability, high win rate.

That does not necessarily mean high returns.

Anyway - I've contacted him already, let's see what he reveals...

 

[adrian2012]

He's already laid the system out.

Trade both ways, take a profit on the one trade and hold the other hoping it comes back.

Then add in some options.

I would not go this far.

Not sure how much you know about options - but this statement of yours makes me think "not that much". By the way, me neither - but I happened to see some options gurus in action: what you can accomplish with "some options", if you know what you're doing, goes beyond most people's imagination.

This is just to suggest that the timing of the first exit (winning trade) and risk management through stops and/or "some options" is probably the brains of the "operation". Trading both ways can easily be unprofitable - so there must be more to it if the system works.

 

[ChocolateDigestive]

This isn't a matter of opinion, as you'll discover if you decide to set light to 15 g-sheets.

I take it then that you haven't asked him why he sells training when he (allegedly) makes in excess of a million dollars a year from trading?

I have asked a few vendors for proof they are profitable and none of them obliged. to be fair one vendor did share his live trading results although I didnt see the blotters, he was only up a few ticks up in a week before commission which was ga5h.

 

[ChocolateDigestive]

I would not go this far.

Not sure how much you know about options - but this statement of yours makes me think "not that much". By the way, me neither - but I happened to see some options gurus in action: what you can accomplish with "some options", if you know what you're doing, goes beyond most people's imagination.

This is just to suggest that the timing of the first exit (winning trade) and risk management through stops and/or "some options" is probably the brains of the "operation". Trading both ways can easily be unprofitable - so there must be more to it if the system works.

you should also consider that options are used by some vendors as a smoke screen, an added layer of complexity. I have an masters degree in physics which included a lot of high level maths, I would ask the vendor about a derivation of black scholes and watch them cack their pants.

 

[brewski1984]

It's more than money for this guy, which I know for some people here is difficult to understand.

If it's more than money for this guy then why does he ask for the 15 grand? Trading is ALL about the money.

I left the second half of the sentence for ironic purposes.

 

[jini]

Point taken. It's a scam.. no doubt about it. End of discussion.

Happy trading everyone.

 

[The Leopard]

Point taken. It's a scam.. no doubt about it. End of discussion.

Happy trading everyone.

By all means, close your ears. One day you will realise that even asking about these kind of things (fifteen grand, and he's not interested in money ) shows a naive and foolish attitude.

But go ahead, keep asking these questions. Somewhere you'll find the answer you seek, and then you can waste your money and learn your lesson.

 

[jini]

Man, your unbelievable. I GET IT.. You think it's a scam. Fantastic.. Great... nuf already.

I thought the forum was open to conversation and possibly a discussion about trading, if people didn't ask any questions there would be nothing to talk about. Lose the chip on the shoulder, life and trading can't be that rough for you... or maybe it can. YIKES.

 

[p-lab]

when I posted I think he was asking for about 8k and now I've heard it's up to 15k.

15K sounds familiar. Must be the new standardised RRP on snake oil

 

[The Leopard]

Man, your unbelievable. I GET IT.. You think it's a scam. Fantastic.. Great... nuf already.

I thought the forum was open to conversation and possibly a discussion about trading, if people didn't ask any questions there would be nothing to talk about. Lose the chip on the shoulder, life and trading can't be that rough for you... or maybe it can. YIKES.

The problem is, you really don't get it.

 

[DionysusToast]

I would not go this far.

Not sure how much you know about options - but this statement of yours makes me think "not that much". By the way, me neither - but I happened to see some options gurus in action: what you can accomplish with "some options", if you know what you're doing, goes beyond most people's imagination.

Sigh...

Look - if you trade both ways, there is zero edge in that. So whatever he's doing with the options might as well be done on it's own.

This is just to suggest that the timing of the first exit (winning trade) and risk management through stops and/or "some options" is probably the brains of the "operation". Trading both ways can easily be unprofitable - so there must be more to it if the system works.

Here's the issue and I'll say it for the last time...

You can create a high win rate system with options. Still, you need an edge with any method of trading. Having a high win rate is not enough.

It's been done here a zillion times.

You still need something else - an edge. That generally comes through NOT being neutral on at least some aspect of the market. Or in other words -it usually depends on having an opinion on something and trading that opinion. Not on let's go long and short at the same time... That is the opposite of having an opinion.

Of course, if you went long and short 2 different stocks with the opinion their correlation would revert to mean - that's an opinion, that's an edge.

 

[DionysusToast]

you should also consider that options are used by some vendors as a smoke screen, an added layer of complexity. I have an masters degree in physics which included a lot of high level maths, I would ask the vendor about a derivation of black scholes and watch them cack their pants.

LOL....

Bottom line with options is this:

They are not a mechanism for the market to hand you free money for zero effort.

They are often presented as the trading equivalent of a perpetual motion machine.

 

[DionysusToast]

15K sounds familiar. Must be the new standardised RRP on snake oil

It's actually the nominal value of 1 snake oil contract on Nymex.

 

[pboyles]

Man, your unbelievable. I GET IT.. You think it's a scam. Fantastic.. Great... nuf already.

I thought the forum was open to conversation and possibly a discussion about trading, if people didn't ask any questions there would be nothing to talk about. Lose the chip on the shoulder, life and trading can't be that rough for you... or maybe it can. YIKES.

It's utter stupidity to give anyone 15k for anything trading related just because he promises to give you a trading system that will make you rich. Its just like sending money to a Nigerian General just because he promises to send you a few million in commission in return.

If you cant see that then you are about to learn a very hard lesson in how this industry operates.