New Day Trader - Help Needed!

jad8688

Newbie
Messages
2
Likes
0
Hi Everyone,

I am relatively new to day trading and I am currently trying to learn the basic's trading quality US stocks.
The main methodology I have been using is looking for key price levels and trading with the direction of the trend. I have mainly been using Fib levels, pivot points and other longer term price levels to determine those 'key areas'.

However, I just don't seem to be going anywhere with this and although my trades seem to look good in theory they tend to move away from me the majority of the time!

For example here is a trade I tried this afternoon which I was consequently stopped out on. I have been using the 5 minute and 15 minute charts as well as the daily going for a top-down approach.

The reasoning behind this trade on V, was to enter on a pull back after the price broke through R1 and pulled back to the 23.60% fib level. I have attached the chart below with the green arrow showing my entry and the red arrow indicating my exit.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers,
James
 

Attachments

  • Visa Trade.pdf
    50.4 KB · Views: 428
there are many things to consider and you have not told us enough about your approach for anyone to help you, from the sound of things its very discretionary which means no one can really help you with it.

HAve you got a clear checklist/plan before entering a trade (written) if you do put it up and someone might be able to help you, if you dont then thats the first thing you should do.

As for your visa trade it looks like you have identified an an uptrend on the 5m late yesterday evening. what made you think the move would continue today?
 
Hi James, I agree with VACO, it's pretty tough because everyone is different when using a discretionary system. Here's a few ideas that I follow that may/maynot help.

First thing though, it looks like you got stopped out at an okay place and you didn't let things run off against you too long hopefully, so that's a success :clap: (small losses, BIG WINS!) Preserving capital is the key to long term success!!

1. When I use the fib's and there has not been a gap I use the current day's high's and lows for daytrading. If there has been a gap I use the closing high/low of the previous day. But still when using the fibs, I look for a bigger pull back then just the first 23.6, although R1 is significant, it's not enough. Based on your drawing it pulled back to the 38.2 level which was better, but I'm always looking for more of a 50% retracement, which based upon my drawing it would have made it there a couple of hours later and would have been an okay move for me from 91.90 to 92.40 or so.

2. Always check the internals, based on how the day opened everything looked lower, but with a steady climb, so either it would be a slow day, which it turned out to be until the end of the day or it would go lower. So based upon that there was not a big expectation of a big positive move like it did in the morning.

3. Looks like your were looking at the 10:30 reversal period which is a great time to trade a pullback, but based on the candles there was no follow through and there was no volume to back it up either.

I'm not sure when you caught this trade, but if you had been seeing it since yesterday another system would be to trade the 2nd 5-min bar, which would have been a great move in hindsight, although based upon internals may have also been stopped out but volume was increasing. This is a very risky system though, but when you have volume and internals with you it can work.

Those are some of my ideas that I would follow.


jrwlkr
 
Hi Guys, thanks for the response you have already given me few things that I can apply to my trading.

At the moment my system is to try and catch intraday break outs, this could be a key price level where the price has stalled at previously or a price channel. At the moment my problem is not identifying such trades but been able to gauge the strength of these moves. And whether the price is going to retrace and continue the breakout or whether it is just a fake out.

The continuous issue that seems to occur is that I go long on the pullback from the breakout and then the price just falls back after I have entered!! Much to my frustration!
 
Since you are using 5 min charts you shouldn't base breakouts from the previous day's intraday uptrend, therefore your fib lines shouldn't carry over into the next day , especially at the open. You got caught in a trap. However, being a new daytrader you are certainy moving in the right direction with your trading. Experience will teach more than any person or book ever will.
Good Luck!

Peter
 
Have you backtested your method? This is a must before risking any money. It appears you are relying on hope that it will work.
 
Hi James,

It is hard to say for sure what is going on here since we do not have enough data on the chart to put the trade in proper context. Some observations by just eyeballing the chart:

1. You have a trend, but we cannot see how long that trend has been in effect. We need to see what the average length of a trend is for this issue. The trend may have been getting a bit tired by the time you entered. We never know when a trend will end, but entering into a trade with a trend that statistically should be nearing an end is a lower probability trade.
2. If you look at the size of the candles in the trend and then compare them to the sharp move up, there is a relatively large difference. Sometimes you will see this last push at the end of a trend that exhausts the trend. It could have been the end of a 5th wave among other things. We cannot tell from the chart.
3. If you put a regression channel on the upward trend, most of the candles would have fallen between the upper and lower parallels of the channel. 95% of the candles are expected to fall in this range. When the sharp move up occurred, it appears as if a number of candles in succession fell outside the channel. This behavior is not statistically expected and in a trend like this, it indicates a change in conditions, or a red flag. Contrast this with a trend with a lot of volatility.
4. Based on what we can see you have a trend without any significant pullbacks on the chart. When you start to develop a larger pull back as occurred where your green arrow is without a significant previous pullback, for me this is a warning sign. Often when a larger pullback does start to develop in this scenario the pull back is greater in time and price than previous pullbacks and more unpredictable. Look at the size difference of the previous pullbacks on the posted chart and compare them to where you entered at the green arrow. When I see this I start to think reversal.
5. It is good to trade in the direction of the daily candle but on the 5 minute chart, in my opinion, you are a bit too far away in time. The hourly would be more relevant.

In hindsight you had some reasons not to take the trade.

You also had some things going for you with me seeing why you entered the trade.

a. Look at the red candle with the pin bar just touching the blue MA about halfway between the 20:00 and 11 on your chart. Now look at the green candle right at 11. I cannot tell for sure since I cannot see the tail, but if you drew a trend line from that pin bar to the area of the likely area of the tail of the green candle at 11, your trend line would probably pass near the open of the candle you entered on, possibly acting as support.
b. If you drew a fib from this same red candle with the pin bar to the high of the trend/thrust, you would have about a 50% retracement where you took the trade.
c. Now you have about a 50% fib, a 23% fib, R1 and probably an upward sloping trend line all in close proximity, a logical area to watch for price to bounce back up.
d. Now draw a trend line from the high of the trend downward along the upper wicks toward the green candle where you took the trade. The green bar where you entered looks as if it would have closed above this trend line. This alone, depending on your trading plan could have been an entry signal.
e. The green bar where you entered is a strong outside bar which closed at the high. Selling pressure was not strong enough to push price down from the high. Some may consider the red bar prior to the green bar you entered on a mini pin bar with price unable to go lower at R1 and your fib level. Price action indicated a reversal or a move back up.
f. Time wise the pullback where you entered seems to be about consistent with the other corrections, depending on what candles you consider measuring each pullback from. However, this pullback is larger and steeper and may be a wave of larger degree. This needs to be added into the overall mix of conditions, and accounted for as to its possible affect on the trade.

My advice would be to develop some effective filtering techniques to identify the warning signs. Just because a setup looks to be a great trade, mechanically meeting all your criteria, does not mean it is when you step back and look at the surrounding conditions. Being able to exclude low probability setups camouflaged as high probability setups is important. Filtering is money management. It frequently prevents you from suffering unnecessary losses by entering into losing or lower probability trades. Evaluating risk is much more involved than just considering position size, entry point and stop placement. Properly weighting each finding of a potential setup, positively and negatively, and then putting it all together in a big picture will often provide a valuable perspective.

"D"
 
Hello James,

They are right it will take many trades for you to home your strategy. Just draw in the range prior noting the the tops and bottoms. This way you would have noticed that breakout and been on the boat.
 
you must only do 20 trades a day for 2 years with the demo not with money then you will get good trades thats all .

take care my friend

Hello James,

They are right it will take many trades for you to home your strategy. Just draw in the range prior noting the the tops and bottoms. This way you would have noticed that breakout and been on the boat.
 
Top