How much would you pay......

[NVP]

How much would you pay......for a system that genuinely produced guaranteed profits ?

answers here ....perhaps we can together finally convince our less experienced traders at T2win of the
folly in paying even a few thousand dollars for that holy grail systems being sold online from the nice guy with the suit and expensive website , plane , beach house and thousands of (fake) testimonials and results he sent you .....

we can but dream....

N

PS - I generated this thread after talking to a few new traders last week who asked me about a bitcoin advert they saw in the fake news world .......since i regularly get such queries i thought i would refresh my advice for anyone in same boat

you will receive the same advice from any serious, experienced and honest Trader.........so save yourself the money and invest it instead in yourself

 

[NVP]

so I come from a financial / commercial corporate background with some 40 years in the game

you value businesses by a multitude of yardsicks but the primo one is future revenue / profit generation

so if someone handed you a guaranteed system .....even say for 5 years guaranteed profits

how much would you expect to pay .......given if its guaranteed sucess.....your staking would become geometrically astronomical very quickly ..........so even perhaps a relatively small edge of say 5% per trade would rapidly increase your capital base

so when you are asked for say £2-300 to receive this system / training .......

what do you think ?

1) this guy has really underpriced his product - he must really like me
2) perhaps its not what it seems

so smell the coffee guys ..........even if you paid £2-3,000 for a system ..........imagine the returns you could make very quickly on the holy grail .............you would generate more returns than the guy who bought google or facebook prelaunch ..........you would be a millionaire inside a year if traded / managed correctly

and all for £3k ?

its all fake guys .....its all fake .........please save your money or talk to experienced traders who can get your head back on quickly ...........

N

 

[tomorton]

All very rational. If anyone had a way to make guaranteed money from trading, they would probably be trading. The individual tasks comprised in trading are easy compared to a real job.

 

[malaguti]

if i had a system which is working for me.. of course i would be trading it
but equally, why would i also not want to have multiple revenue streams? a nice steady income as well as my trading income from selling my system. it makes perfect sense to me

so, back to the question..how much would you pay.
the person selling the system doesn't want it too low as it just competes with all others. then equally you don't want it too high..however look at Apple's pricing policy, and that too of jaguar land rover. they deliberately created a price that was higher than others just so that they were perceived as premium.

also, the person selling isn't just selling one, he/she wants to sell loads, yet still keep this product premium..£1000 sounds about right

 

[tomorton]

Its much easier to trade a reliable system than it is to sell anything to many many one-off customers. That's damn hard work. And the more customers you sell the system to, the higher the probability some of them will start selling it on for themselves, so your returns are only likely to diminish while your effort is only likely to increase.

 

[malaguti]

Its much easier to trade a reliable system than it is to sell anything to many many one-off customers. That's damn hard work. And the more customers you sell the system to, the higher the probability some of them will start selling it on for themselves, so your returns are only likely to diminish while your effort is only likely to increase.

Wouldn't disagree for a second. It just annoys me when some say if you had a profitable system why would they sell it
Why the f would you NOT
It may be harder and diminishing returns a good point but it sure shouldn't stop me trying. Every grand adds up

 

[trendie]

Thats a really good question, NVP.
Equally, you could ask a purchaser, "What do you think you are paying for?" when buying a system?

 

[NVP]

Thats a really good question, NVP.
Equally, you could ask a purchaser, "What do you think you are paying for?" when buying a system?

i ask this all the time to people who contact me for training.........i think anyone who has ever mentored or trained should be 100% open with students and make it clear that they are only there to assist them on their journey and not provide some holy grail or guaranteed system

i make it clear i am not out to create clones .....it is impossible .......i want traders to grow and evolve into their own styles ........generally based on taking bits and pieces from what they have learnt from me and others over their years of studying trading

so i provide insights and ideas and strategies based on what i have learnt ..........up to the trader to then utilise as they see fit

I am proud to say i have never seen any ex student still 100% using what i do ....they all develop in different ways

similar to me .....i have never adopted any mentors system 100% ..........in fact there isnot much at all from any mentors really ....all pretty much based on my own design and experimentation over the years ....

N

 

[NVP]

Wouldn't disagree for a second. It just annoys me when some say if you had a profitable system why would they sell it
Why the f would you NOT
It may be harder and diminishing returns a good point but it sure shouldn't stop me trying. Every grand adds up

this is an interesting one ..........since pretty much all of my system(s) incorporate elements of discretionary trading I cant actually provide someone with a "use these 6 indicators in alignment on this timeframe on this market" style system

so in fact I'm happy to flog them at a decent price when i do get back in the game eventually ......im providing knowledge and not a black box solution

i think a lot of people go this route now ........even the scammers have cottoned onto offering academys and schools instead of the black nox nonsence.....still means a lot of them are teaching free stuff available online if you look.....but thats up to the poor suckers who think they are getting real value.........

thats what we all scream at newbies to spend time online for a few months to realise how much is out there for free

then they can realise quickly how much fluff is sitting in these academys prospectuses and demand the money back immediately !!!

to have spent a few hundred quid learning what a platform is and candlesticks and timeframes etc etc ..... and then be offered a "special" ma crossover system is scandalous .........but hey .......this is a pretty messy and dark business we all play in - alongside our friends in the gambling industry (semantics)

the last time I offered training I piloted a scheme offered to around 100 people i think .........

it was quite a few years back ..................ironically the main feedback was people wanted more basic training than what i was offering ......

plus - I didnt have the time or energy to teach beginners ....so I gave quite a few their money back and said to go research online....with little training they didnt have a clue what i was talking about anyway in truth .....so why bother ......

my next course again will probably stipulate intermediate traders as entry level .....but wont hold my breath that people read the small print ....they never do .....hahahaha


N

 

[NVP]

Its much easier to trade a reliable system than it is to sell anything to many many one-off customers. That's damn hard work. And the more customers you sell the system to, the higher the probability some of them will start selling it on for themselves, so your returns are only likely to diminish while your effort is only likely to increase.

oh yeah......100% agree Tom ..............I remember seeing someone flogging a correlation technique that bore a rediculously similar wording (to the letter and even diagrams) that was on one of my (private membership) websites at the time

the stupid thing was they were teaching it wrong ......they didnt have a clue ......hahahaha

on a more serious note anyone who publishes decent and valued content must realise that plagiarism will entail eventually .......thats a fact of life ...........but at least one can keep ones reputation intact in selling ones own content .......the scmucks replicating it will usually be losers off some dodgy e-bay listed service that only fools would follow

well in theory anyway !

N

 

[fibo_trader]

How much would you pay......for a system that genuinely produced guaranteed profits ?

that one word causes an instant right-click\send to\Recycle Bin or Nigeria

 

[fibo_trader]

Wouldn't disagree for a second. It just annoys me when some say if you had a profitable system why would they sell it
Why the f would you NOT
It may be harder and diminishing returns a good point but it sure shouldn't stop me trying. Every grand adds up

No karnal, NO. You think too small, karnal. Where is the honor in selling the dream of a lifetime?

Listen to Johnny here, he is 100% correct. You don't sell the dream of a lifetime, you use it quietly for yourself, without fanfare, you build your castle on it, then give it to your children with their WORD as a promise to not divulge and have them pass it on to their offspring on to infinity. Selling it is sooooooo short-sighted, it kills the system quickly when traders pile on.

No karnal, me thinks you got a lot more to learn from brother Fibo.

 

[fibo_trader]

Thats a really good question, NVP.
Equally, you could ask a purchaser, "What do you think you are paying for?" when buying a system?

Wrong! Since the purchaser is buying it means you are selling - your question makes you a terrible CLOSER by allowing the buyer to shoot you down in one shot with such a stupid question.

First, during your presentation of the TRADING SYSTEM, you spend time building VALUE - open his eyes to the possibilities that such a system could bring to his life, let his eyes roll and his mind wander into the depths of big money returns and the stuff aka benefits to him and his family. Build, build, build VALUE.

Then you go for the Jugular with a full eye-contact Closing Question - then shut the hell up. The first person who speaks after a closing question has been delivered, LOSES. So you wait for his answer. 90% of the time the deal will go down right there. The times that it does not, you wait ferret out the objection, then rehash the benefits and then go for the Jug again.

Only p***ies drop Price. Dropping Price at the first sign of resistance from a customer is weakness of the worst kind in a closer. Stand firm, you've built VALUE, he gets it, PRICE will not be an issue. If it is, you have not built value. That makes you a bum.

Build value amigos, lots of value, then it comes as easy as molasses.

Been doing it forever, never fails, never will fail.

 

[fibo_trader]

In real life, outside of TRADING and approx. before starting trading THEY always wondered aloud how the fck they get the Price objection from customers as in, "your Price is too steep" for the same identical product that Fibo sells routinely for double the Price with zero objections and dig this, 50% of the time the customers say to fibo, "Price is relatively inexpensive" Go figure



President Barack's hometown in Kenya. He got my vote. Unmistakable Tanzanian gee-tar

 

[Pat494]

If I had a winning system I would offer it on a £100 deposit and 10% of first years' profits.
One would hope the customers are so pleased to be making money that they wouldn't begrudge a measly 10%.

No gain no pain !!

 

[0007]

If I had a winning system I would offer it on a £100 deposit and 10% of first years' profits.
One would hope the customers are so pleased to be making money that they wouldn't begrudge a measly 10%.

No gain no pain !!

If you have a winning system why not just milk it regularly? No need to involve anybody else, no pain & lots of (compounding) gain.

 

[fibo_trader]

In real life, outside of TRADING and approx. before starting trading THEY always wondered aloud how the fck they get the Price objection from customers as in, "your Price is too steep" for the same identical product that Fibo sells routinely for double the Price with zero objections and dig this, 50% of the time the customers say to fibo, "Price is relatively inexpensive" Go figure



President Barack's hometown in Kenya. He got my vote. Unmistakable Tanzanian gee-tar

yippie kai yeh mofos, I forgot the creme de la creme ...... Referrals ...........not only was my Price the highest, often more than double the 2nd place contender, and rarely getting any significant objection regarding high price, here is where the icing came on the cake ........... the customers would call every now and then and whisper the sweet melody, "Fibo my friend/cousin/grandma/brother/boss/whatever wants it too, can you fix them up?"

But wait, it gets better ................................. usually a girl, often a married girl would be so enchanted with Fibo that not only would she bring referrals to him regularly, often she would stage a party at her house for her nurses and doctor friends and associates and invite Fibo too. Why? Because at the party Fibo would be shooting ducks in a barrel - 20-30 sales in one evening. The girl would clock $15k in one evening in comms and laff her ass off all the way to the bank. On top of that, when the deals alll cashed out, fibo would bomb her with yet another solid 10k check just for the fck of it so she could take her husband to the Bahamas or wherever.

Nobody in the industry wanted to sell to Arabs. Fibo didn't give a fck. He'd go in and do the usual pitch and song and dance. Then at the close, he would just say, " I know you cannot afford this so I'll let you make small payments" Fck that, they'd pull out the checkbook and pay on the spot. Hahahahahahaha.

What a country! America! Only in America do they understand FULLY that nobody makes a dime unless/until a product or service is SOLD! Europe?= Dark Ages. UK?=a bug on America's shoe.


No Sir, there ain't nothing like America! Delightful place for hunters of all kinds

The HOME of fibo shines like a star, hahahahahaha

 

[fibo_trader]

Wouldn't disagree for a second. It just annoys me when some say if you had a profitable system why would they sell it
Why the f would you NOT
It may be harder and diminishing returns a good point but it sure shouldn't stop me trying. Every grand adds up

Repeat: You don't sell the dream of a lifetime

@ 1:56

 

[correct23]

I don't think there is a holy grail. I use and pay to Bookmap, which gives me an edge in my trading. I pay a reasonable money relatively to the add in winning trades it produces

 

[Pat494]

If it was a stand alone EA that was profitable I would pay but if it is just an airy fairy looking at charts and trying to make a judgement that may be wrong I would not.