Are profits tax-free?

[Vint]

I see that they clearly are for financial fixed odds betting and spread betting, but that's not really what I'm asking.

Basically, I use ladbrokes, and if I made 10 grand say over a longer time period and suddenly withdrew 10K to my bank, isn't my bank going to catch up with me (or the government or whatever) and ask if I'm going to be taxing that?

Say I made a million and withdrew a million, surely the government are going to want some of it?

Thanks for any help.

 

[D70]

The definition is "if your MAIN SOURCE of income isnt derived from spread betting / gambling, it is tax free"

For anyone out there making "a living" from spread betting and not paying any tax - keep it under your hat coz you should be paying HMRC.

 

[Vint]

Haha okay sounds good. So if these "people" kept it under their hats, it'd be highly unlikely for them to be caught out provided that they have another job? Or do HMRC look into it very carefully?

Still, it sounds pretty good..

 

[new_trader]

The definition is "if your MAIN SOURCE of income isnt derived from spread betting / gambling, it is tax free"

For anyone out there making "a living" from spread betting and not paying any tax - keep it under your hat coz you should be paying HMRC.

There are at least half a dozen people in this forum who brag about being a full time trader making squillions out of their "strat" or "edge" completely tax free because they are spred-bettin'.

 

[Vint]

Also another newbie question, are brokers somewhat corrupt like you hear about casinos in vegas, in the sense that if you keep winning and actually making a consistent significant income out of it, they'll cut you out or ban you from using their service, as you'll be causing them to lose out long-term..

obviously it's illegal for them to do it, but they have ways like suspecting you of cheating etc

 

[new_trader]

Also another newbie question, are brokers somewhat corrupt like you hear about casinos in vegas, in the sense that if you keep winning and actually making a consistent significant income out of it, they'll cut you out or ban you from using their service, as you'll be causing them to lose out long-term..

obviously it's illegal for them to do it, but they have ways like suspecting you of cheating etc

Ah yes, banned from the bucket shops. There are a few here who make the same claim to fame as the legendary Jesse Livermore, cracks me up

 

[Vint]

so that means it's possible then? ha..

 

[D70]

There are at least half a dozen people in this forum who brag about being a full time trader making squillions out of their "strat" or "edge" completely tax free because they are spred-bettin'.

Well, it's up to them to tell hmrc, should they want to.

 

[D70]

Also another newbie question, are brokers somewhat corrupt like you hear about casinos in vegas, in the sense that if you keep winning and actually making a consistent significant income out of it, they'll cut you out or ban you from using their service, as you'll be causing them to lose out long-term..

obviously it's illegal for them to do it, but they have ways like suspecting you of cheating etc

It depends on who you use as some brokers are better than others.
I have only been thrown off one brokers platform.

Keep to the big established names and you'll be fine.

 

[The Artist]

I see that they clearly are for financial fixed odds betting and spread betting, but that's not really what I'm asking.

Basically, I use ladbrokes, and if I made 10 grand say over a longer time period and suddenly withdrew 10K to my bank, isn't my bank going to catch up with me (or the government or whatever) and ask if I'm going to be taxing that?

Say I made a million and withdrew a million, surely the government are going to want some of it?

Thanks for any help.

Hey,
If you can make a million from your couch and do nothing else, I assume the 28% capital gain tax you will owe HMRC will not be that big of a problem.
Now, if you make something a bit more realistic to start with, say, 10k/month, it is wise to show HMRC some part-time work activity, even though that income is lower than your gains, and you should be fine.

 

[Vint]

okay cool. Do you think it would work if I aimed to increase my bank by 10% each day? theoretically I'd be making £100 plus per day in about 6 months (just financial fixed odds)

 

[new_trader]

Hey,
If you can make a million from your couch and do nothing else, I assume the 28% capital gain tax you will owe HMRC will not be that big of a problem.
Now, if you make something a bit more realistic to start with, say, 10k/month, it is wise to show HMRC some part-time work activity, even though that income is lower than your gains, and you should be fine.

A few “if’s” and “shoulds” in there so I assume you are not speaking from experience? I suppose I can imagine the HMRC being so unbelievably stupid and incompetent that they wouldn’t question why someone earning £10K/month spred-bettin’ would also have a part-time job that pays much, much less.

In any case, you are the first and only person I have ever read who says that in order to avoid/evade tax on spred-bettin’ profits you need to have another source of income. All the other spred-bettas simply argue that spred-bettin’ profits are tax free because it is spred-bettin’!

 

[Chartsy]

talk to an accountant

 

[Masquerade]

I see that they clearly are for financial fixed odds betting and spread betting, but that's not really what I'm asking.

Basically, I use ladbrokes, and if I made 10 grand say over a longer time period and suddenly withdrew 10K to my bank, isn't my bank going to catch up with me (or the government or whatever) and ask if I'm going to be taxing that?

Say I made a million and withdrew a million, surely the government are going to want some of it?

Thanks for any help.

It's gambling, eat your heart out and go make those millions tax free

 

[The Artist]

A few “if’s” and “shoulds” in there so I assume you are not speaking from experience? I suppose I can imagine the HMRC being so unbelievably stupid and incompetent that they wouldn’t question why someone earning £10K/month spred-bettin’ would also have a part-time job that pays much, much less.

In any case, you are the first and only person I have ever read who says that in order to avoid/evade tax on spred-bettin’ profits you need to have another source of income. All the other spred-bettas simply argue that spred-bettin’ profits are tax free because it is spred-bettin’!

Only 1 "should" actually
I am speaking from experience in the sense that I have had this conversation a few times with people who were in that situation, both out of curiosity to begin with, and more recently for my own benefit as I hope to be in this predicament quite soon.
Now, this is not a reflection of HMRC's competence or intelligence. HMRC will more than likely (again I have to use ifs, shoulds, and likelys because there are not a lot of well documented precedents publicly available) come after you. However, this is about what they can prove in a court of law, and, in this particular situation, you will be ok if you can prove that you have an other source of taxable income. That is the beauty of common law, and I am just relaying the information you will get from specialised income tax legal shops.
I was just answering the question of the OP. I am not advocating tax evasion here As far as I'm concerned, I'd rather even pay those 28% every month rather than live in fear of a massive backlash down the line. And I would hope the OP will not rely entirely on the responses he will get there and would seek professional legal advice eventually.

 

[Vint]

okay cool. Do you think it would work if I aimed to increase my bank by 10% each day? theoretically I'd be making £100 plus per day in about 6 months (just financial fixed odds)

Thanks guys. Any help with this question? Is this realistic?

So eventually say I got to 500 GBP, I'd be making 50 GBP a day.

 

[Masquerade]

Probably not realistic and I don't understand why you'd want to trade those fixed odds. They're heavily in the favour of the bookies and you'd be better off making the trades via a broker. What interests you to doing it via fixed odds?

 

[Vint]

it's a quick return and it's simple, with much less risk.

Spread betting could cause me to just become bankrupt as a beginner

 

[Masquerade]

I'm not so sure about the risk. You can always manage your risk very easily in trading. You will be taking bets with a negative expectancy. I'd not choose to play that game personally.

 

[Vint]

I'm actually under 18 and I have to use my brother's name and card etc. The most I want to put in is 10 GBP, make some money, withdraw my winnings and build from there (slowly but surely).

I keep blowing it accidentally after having good streaks, though I am learning. I haven't lost anything technically so far, just winnings.

fixed odds seems the best bet for me just now I think.. I don't think I understand spread betting enough

will a broker make money whether I win or lose on spread betting, meaning my account will never get barred unlike fixed odds?