dbfx - Market maker or ECN?

Hi everyone,

I posted a similar enquiry on the sticky at the top of this page, but thought it best to start a new thread.
This is what I posted yesterday:
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Anyone with experience with Deutsche Bank's dbfx?
Are they any good? Are they a Market maker or ECN?
Does the luxury of having the name Deutsche Bank associated with it imply that they are legitimate and will not go stop hunting, etc?

TIA.
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In between my 2 posts, I received a reply from dbfx regarding the very same matter.
Since I have not contacted the dbfx rep who emailed me for permission to reprint his email, I will paraphrase what he said.
According to the dbfx rep, "... we are neither an ECN nor a Market Maker. We are a bank....." and that dbfx allows their clients to trade at interbank rates on margin rather than credit. He goes on to list 5 points on dbfx's operation.
Points no. 2 and 3, which I will reproduce below, isn't quite clear to me. Perhaps someone can help me out?

"2. Truly automatic straight through processing execution with no administrative costs.
3. Institutional Pricing and account configurations based on notional volume traded per month. "


Does no. 2 imply that there is no dealing desk?


Thanks again for any insight.


cheers.

Yes,they are Bank. But for forex business in the UK, they are not regulated by FSA. And MM or ECN (a sort of MTS)are terms deifinated in FSA handbook. Tecnically, they are operating spot forex as MM.

I think DBFX is just white label of FXCM. But due to FSA regulation your money is more secure, also parent bank- DB Frankfurt will support for sure in case of failure.

That's good to hear...

better use atcbrokers, varengoldfx, they are the true ecn broker..

Act is not true ECN, it is connected to to Hotspot through bridge, but first you can't see market depth, you can't get partial fill. MT4 is not for ECNs, it is only to trade with best bid best offer price, a true ECN provides ability to chose counterparty. In case of ACT it is only single liquidity provider even it is agreegated liquidity.
Sorry, it is reality.
Only True ECNs -Currenex, Hotspot, Baxter, Lava, Integral, Fxall, EBS, T360,

Wolffx said:

Act is not true ECN, it is connected to to Hotspot through bridge, but first you can't see market depth, you can't get partial fill. MT4 is not for ECNs, it is only to trade with best bid best offer price, a true ECN provides ability to chose counterparty. In case of ACT it is only single liquidity provider even it is agreegated liquidity.
Sorry, it is reality.
Only True ECNs -Currenex, Hotspot, Baxter, Lava, Integral, Fxall, EBS, T360,

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eh.. even connected MT4 from currenex also not considered ecn? whats the full name for T360? never heard of it.

btw is ebs = vcapfx?

EBc is ICAP, Vcapfx is an intermediary only ( like Introducing broker).
MT4 can not be an ECN, even it is connected to Currenex.
ECN is when you can chose a price and deal with several counterparties.
t360 is quite well known tecnhology provider like currenex, used by banks.

Spreads And Swap Are Horrible

there service are good but the spreads and swap are the worst in the industry.

Actually you can get a spread as low as 0.5 pip and just 20 usd commission per one million traded, absolutely the same as offers interactive brokers. Contact me if you are interested.
SWAPSof DBFX are not so bad by the way, i saw much worther

Wolffx said:

Actually you can get a spread as low as 0.5 pip and just 20 usd commission per one million traded, absolutely the same as offers interactive brokers. Contact me if you are interested.
SWAPSof DBFX are not so bad by the way, i saw much worther

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if this is true then this should be there standard business model, also does a trader have to meet a certain volume per month to get that deal? b.t.w. who are you?

Dbfx is a liquidity provider and prices on their platform are tradeable prices, unlike the brokers who go to stp brokers like dbfx.

No better place to trade.money is secure ,spreads are true market spreads and variable spreads, unlike bucket shops fixing spreads and playing games on fills.The bucket shops and ECNS fix spreads and are using manipulated feeds.No one including Goldman Sacks can manipulate forex,otherwise they need paulson for another few bailouts.Fixed spreads are false spreads by cheating brokers and false ECN cowboys.

To use DBFX always place limit orders , cause spreads can widen in real market

using limit orders on a single bank platform like DBFX won't help you. You won't get given at your level ususally till the platform's offered there. All it does is automate to increase speed and mitigate 'fat finger' risk.

A true ecn will allow you the opportunity to earn rather than always cross the spread. But only if you're set up the right way. If, for example, you have a currenex platform, but the only liquidity you see is a bunch of aggregated streaming bank feeds it's not a true ecn environment, it just looks a bit like one. Common misconception.

GJ

GammaJammer said:

using limit orders on a single bank platform like DBFX won't help you. You won't get given at your level ususally till the platform's offered there. All it does is automate to increase speed and mitigate 'fat finger' risk.

A true ecn will allow you the opportunity to earn rather than always cross the spread. But only if you're set up the right way. If, for example, you have a currenex platform, but the only liquidity you see is a bunch of aggregated streaming bank feeds it's not a true ecn environment, it just looks a bit like one. Common misconception.

GJ

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G J

The direct liquidity providers have more volatile prices ,their prices normally lead the FX marketmakers.Watch the DBFX platform side by side with a marketmaker's platform and spot the difference.The fx market makers have to add their own spread of at least 2 pips and maybe more , on top of the liquidity provider's spread.The effect of the more volatile prices on DBFX, I would say at least 5 to 10 times more volatile , is in effect worth 1 pip off the spread of DBFX.

There is a definite and huge advantage trading with DBFX.It amounts to 3 pips reduction in spread, compared to the marketmakers.DBFX control 20 % of daily volume, the bucket shops control nothing.

They don't do front running pending orders, which many of the others do.


ODT

I think your use of the term 'market maker' here is potentially misleading. Anyone taking a price, spreading it, and feeding it back out again isn't a market maker. Who are you citing as an example of this?

Definitions need to be clear in order for this sort of discussion to lead anywhere. Too many retail traders use terms like broker, market maker, ecn interchangeably and more often than not incorrectly. That is one key reason for all the misconceptions regarding liquidity and the nature of the relationship between primary, secondary and downstream pricing.

GJ

G J

The top liquidity providers are Deutsche bank,U B S , Barclays,R B S , Citicorp,Bank of America,JP Morgan and HSBC.Deutsche,Barclays,U B S and Citi trade directly with retail and control 50% of daily fx volume and liquidity.They quote executable prices.

Alpari,Saxo,FXCM,c m c , I G , ODL ,interactive ,O D L etc are all marketmakers and these all go to the liquidity providers for fills .They only quote prices for currencies they may not be fill orders on.Their prices are not always executable prices.

If price is moving in one direction , without more than 2 to 3 pip retracement , the market makers won't fill orders.

O D T

oildaytrader said:

G J

The top liquidity providers are Deutsche bank,U B S , Barclays,R B S , Citicorp,Bank of America,JP Morgan and HSBC.Deutsche,Barclays,U B S and Citi trade directly with retail and control 50% of daily fx volume and liquidity.They quote executable prices.

Alpari,Saxo,FXCM,c m c , I G , ODL ,interactive ,O D L etc are all marketmakers and these all go to the liquidity providers for fills .They only quote prices for currencies they may not be fill orders on.Their prices are not always executable prices.

If price is moving in one direction , without more than 2 to 3 pip retracement , the market makers won't fill orders.

O D T

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I'll agree with GJ that your use of the term market maker is potentially misleading the way it's being used.

Also, FXCM uses no dealing desk execution. The volume is being passed through directly to the banks for execution.

Jason Rogers said:

I'll agree with GJ that your use of the term market maker is potentially misleading the way it's being used.

Also, FXCM uses no dealing desk execution. The volume is being passed through directly to the banks for execution.

Click to expand...

Jason

Most of brokers present themselves to be market makers.This leads many to be confused .The brokers quote bid and offer price they are willing to buy and sell at, they are pretending to be market makers.

They are not presenting themselves as brokers i.e intermediaries who buy and sell for a commission.No commission is charged separately.

They are all brokers , until they honour a stop loss two days later and at 200 pips away from the trader's actual entry price.In the meantime they pretended to be marketmakers, until the trade went wrong i.e 200 pip loss.The bucket shops have really confused things.

Oanda used to trade on weekends as a market maker , but really they are a broker working for a spread.

L O L

O D T

oildaytrader said:

G J

The top liquidity providers are Deutsche bank,U B S , Barclays,R B S , Citicorp,Bank of America,JP Morgan and HSBC.Deutsche,Barclays,U B S and Citi trade directly with retail and control 50% of daily fx volume and liquidity.They quote executable prices.

Alpari,Saxo,FXCM,c m c , I G , ODL ,interactive ,O D L etc are all marketmakers and these all go to the liquidity providers for fills .They only quote prices for currencies they may not be fill orders on.Their prices are not always executable prices.

If price is moving in one direction , without more than 2 to 3 pip retracement , the market makers won't fill orders.

O D T

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Thanks for that. In the 15 years I've been doing this, working at a variety of tier one / tier two banks, institutions, proprietary trading firms etc I never actually figured out who the big players were. Awesome. Any more pearls of wisdom for me?

GammaJammer said:

Thanks for that. In the 15 years I've been doing this, working at a variety of tier one / tier two banks, institutions, proprietary trading firms etc I never actually figured out who the big players were. Awesome. Any more pearls of wisdom for me?

Click to expand...

Yes

Cause you are smarter than me.I learnt the hard way by trying to make money from these forex brokers.

Ever realise how they some front run their clients with slippage?Stop orders are market orders , and it is a licence to rape trader's accounts with slippage.Guess that won't happen at DBFX , one more advantage of trading away from the bucket shops.

The damned truth on front running is coming your way.soon.

Somebody forgot the 2 to 3 pips slippage on stop loss orders at bucket shops

Facts:My live account made 20% last 6 months, were it not for the marketmaker ,it would have made 40%.I ran demo accounts and live accounts simultaenously, using same systems and execution.Many of my orders did not get filled in fast moving markets:cheesy:

O D T