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Benron

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Does any one out there have any good methods for trading on the ftse binary? It would be interesting to see if anyone is using TA on binary charts or is it more a fundamental and news sensitive product?
Anyway it would be good to hear from other binary traders out there.

Regards,
Ben
 
Benron said:
Does any one out there have any good methods for trading on the ftse binary? It would be interesting to see if anyone is using TA on binary charts or is it more a fundamental and news sensitive product?
Anyway it would be good to hear from other binary traders out there.

Regards,
Ben

Yes i use combination TA and what impact the news will have on FTSE 100. Like what time keys data will be relased in UK and US and put my positions accordingly. Once in a while i would like to check on fundamentals. What method do you use yourself?
 
Sorry I didnt get back to you sooner. I am still getting to know how they work. I like to see what other markets have done and also see what the commodities are doing then I take an "educated guess" but I also like to look for "cheap" buys although I understand this meens that the odds are against me.
 
Binary bet trading

Hi

I'm a software developer and have developed an application platform for trading Ftse100 up down bets.

The development of this application has essentially come to an end.

I have decided to contribute some of the knowledge gained to a forum in the hope of assisting in the trading strategies of like minded traders.

There are obviously some areas that I am unable to comment upon namely the specifics of key algorithms. However I will generalise. This is because the algorithms are being further developed for use in other trading strategies/approaches.

My background:

Educated to A level. ( in the days when A-levels meant something)
Open University maths degree (not completed) mainly concentrating on probability & non linear dynamics.

Between the age of 21 – 30 I was working as an accountant
My spare time was spent developing and testing statistical models of stock market behaviour. By the age of 26 I had developed a basic reliable algorithm that seemed to work.

Between 1998 – 2000 I traded the algorithm (a very simplified version) and made enough money to pay off the mortgage.

re-trained as a software developer.

Between 2001 – 2004 I worked as a software developer on military systems.

In early 2003 I tried some manual binary betting (without any software system in place) resulting in highly varied results (that is I won then lost it all back !)

By December 2003 myself and a colleague had developed a basic system which was able to grab real time data from the binary bet web site analyse and generate trading signals. The signals were emailed and sent via msn to us.

The software has gone through various versions to the current and final version v 3.2. the changes have essentially been in revised logic rules and improvements to algorithms. There have been no changes to rules or algorithms for approx 14 mths.

The software has a success rate of 83% . Namely following the signals results in 83% of the trades being closed at a profit.

The software was developed with the idea of freeing myself from the drudgery of having to work for someone else. The objective was to sell up move abroad and trade from a pleasant sunny climate.

Two factors have conspired to block the objective . The first is I actually enjoy my job and earn enough that I don’t want to leave it. The second is despite the success of the system I couldn’t stop myself from second guessing it. This caused an immense amount of stress./ addiction like feeding a fruit machine !

The last continuous period of trading was 13 weeks leading up to the London bombings. The account was opened with £1000 and before the bombings stood at approx £1600.

Average bet was approx £3/pt.

The application is not for sale.

The first area of concern when developing the system was being able to grab the binary bet prices. We were able to do this via a little know back door into the Bin bet web site. This is the link LINK Removed that stored FTSE up down data. (the link has now been changed ie it doesn’t store ftse data but you can obtain currency and commodity data from it) You could essentially get their prices by loading the web page address into an application and simply reading the html file. The link produces a static page , but keep refreshing it and the data is updated. This is what we did in code, kept calling that page 1020 times a day to be precise J.

In actual fact all this information really gives a trader is the knowledge that when they get a signal they know what the current bin bet price is. However by the time you’ve logged into the web site to place the trade it’s historic which means you could get a marginally better or worse price. Being able to grab a full days data allowed us to back engineer the pricing algorithm. Essentially this is a time decay function with the movement of the index from the open (+/- amount) superimposed along with some function that prices in volatility .

Whether there underlying model is based on the futures price was irrelevant in developing our own model of bin bet prices. What we wanted was a model that gets us pretty close to the Bin bet pricing model. Being able to grab the data from the site enabled us to do this.

We now have about 300 + days of actual bin bet & FTSE 100 Up Down price data, that we can use for testing various strategies against

Obviously they could always change their model. But doing so could have a fairly severe impact on their profitability especially in volatile markets. Plus as long as market behaviour stays the same then I can’t see the pricing model changing much.


Our pricing model isn’t an exact match of Bin bet price model. We are able to to get within 2% of bin bet price for 90% of prices, but we can diverge by as much as 10% of the bin bet price when market volatility increases. We suspect that the bin bet volatility function is protecting them from opportunistic traders by frightening them off with extreme prices, or limiting any profits. However we found that during high periods of volatility especially in the morning or early afternoon our model might be indicating a price of 78 when the bin bet price might be closer to 83 or 84. These differences completely disappear as the market approaches close. And bin bet price and our model merge.

When developing our price we would often get prices above 100. At first we thought our model was wrong, but we think that bin bet get similar pricing. However when their sys generates a price above 100 they just display 100 . So they have a rule something like.

If (nUpbuyPrice > 100)
{
nUpbuyPrice = 100;
Display (nUpBuyPrice);
}

The trade signalling is based on determining high probability turning points using non-linear functions. That’s really as far as I can go on the signalling. The ability to know when a significant turn is coming is key to the systems success (especially in volatile markets). Our difficulty was in determining magnitude ie by how much the index was likely to move. This represented a significant hurdle and left exposed to some volatile reading periods. However we believe we may have found a solution that is being developed.


Hope this helps, encourages enlightens or amuses J
 
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What is the score on your binary trading....figs wise mate.....after using your system
Do you make much money out of them now if so are you going to sell a system at the end of this..............
I would like to know

Thanks
rav
 
Just had a look at the trading hsitory file between Jan28 2004 and July 27 2005 the sys generated 1939 ticks profit. So at £10 per tick thats £19,390. this does not indicate every day in that period. There were some days when the sys couldn't be traded due to Internet failures or data logging crashing the sys. This period represents 264 trading days. the % profitability is 83.587%
I'd be happy to upload the trading results. if people wanted.

However bear in mind that is what the system would have made if you had followed every signal. My problem was as I pointed out that I couldn't help trying to second guess the bloody thing.
I'm certainly not saying that I HAVE made £19390. Just that I could have done had I been as disciplined as the software

There's no intention to sell this application. My reasons for divulging some information is hopefully to bring forward and hopefully encourage some technical discussions about binary trading generally.
 
Chris S said:
Just had a look at the trading hsitory file between Jan28 2004 and July 27 2005 the sys generated 1939 ticks profit. So at £10 per tick thats £19,390. this does not indicate every day in that period. There were some days when the sys couldn't be traded due to Internet failures or data logging crashing the sys. This period represents 264 trading days. the % profitability is 83.587%
I'd be happy to upload the trading results. if people wanted.

However bear in mind that is what the system would have made if you had followed every signal. My problem was as I pointed out that I couldn't help trying to second guess the bloody thing.
I'm certainly not saying that I HAVE made £19390. Just that I could have done had I been as disciplined as the software

There's no intention to sell this application. My reasons for divulging some information is hopefully to bring forward and hopefully encourage some technical discussions about binary trading generally.

83% Very impressive so if you had put £100 and you follow up your system you will up to tune of £193900. How long did it take you to put your system together and how much did it cost you?
 
The software took approx 6 mths to put together. Bear in mind however that the core logic ie algorythms have been developed and refined over a period of years and were already developed. Its not rocket science to read data from a web site in real time. The hardest part of the development was knowing whether you have a system that will work.

In order to determine this ahead of a Go Live we had to extract real time Ftse Data and use this to back test against. However we only had a very small sample of data. To increase the confidence level in the system the development of a FTSE MODEL (ie a simulated FTSE 100) is essential.

Back testing a strategy against 1 or 2 years Actual data iss irrelevant.
A) because its historic, B) There's no money on the line so theres no physchological pressure.

The problem I've found with the majority of "systems" is that the person developing it dosn't want to prove it is a failure they want to prove it a success.

We set out to try and break the application. Finding the breaks allows you to understand the limitations of the app and how the market works

The idea of testing against extreme volatility scenarios was to understand a) whether it still performed ie protected the user by either refusing to trade or minimising losses or closing out a profitaable situation early or whether it just let you get destroyed in such situations.

By developing a model we can increase or decrease the amount of volatility and see how the application deals with varying scenarios. (I would say that developing such a model is absolutely vital to the testing and development process)

The results from the model are vital in building confidence. Plus you can test against thousands of
simulated trading days. Essentially probing your rules / strategy for weaknesses.
 
Interesting work, I like it.

Chris S said:
The software has a success rate of 83% . Namely following the signals results in 83% of the trades being closed at a profit.

Can you give some indication of the risk / reward, or by how much your system "outperforms the odds". (If they have a 4-point spread and I buy at 85, maybe around 83% of my trades would be profitable.)

Chris S said:
Being able to grab a full days data allowed us to back engineer the pricing algorithm. Essentially this is a time decay function with the movement of the index from the open (+/- amount) superimposed along with some function that prices in volatility .

When developing our price we would often get prices above 100. At first we thought our model was wrong, but we think that bin bet get similar pricing. However when their sys generates a price above 100 they just display 100 . So they have a rule something like.

If (nUpbuyPrice > 100)
{
nUpbuyPrice = 100;
Display (nUpBuyPrice);
}

I'd be surprised if binarybet are doing something like this. I have studied the prices for the DOW binaries on tradesports (you can download ascii files containing the prices that trades occured at from their website, and the trades are so frequent that you can analyse the variation of the market makers' prices). I briefly looked into arbitrage between tradesports and binarybet and other sites (just by comparing prices by eye in real time), but found there are hardly any opportunities given the size of the spreads - so there is a good chance that binarybet are using a similar pricing model.

My analysis showed that the pricing is pretty damn close to textbook stuff: essentially Black-Scholes plus a simple volatility model (basically constant intraday but increased if the market starts moving massively or ahead of big data releases etc) plus a smile that increases the prices in the wings though it's hardly noticeable given the spreads. I sometimes saw some strange stuff and put it down to either errors or the market makers trying to reduce their positions by raising / lowering their prices. I didn't see any convincing evidence that the market makers consistently try to skew their prices if they think the market is trending.

Anyway, my point is that I think the only ways to make money off binaries are by either predicting the direction that the market is going in, or predicting future volatility better than their volatility model. Hence any automated system that reliably makes money and outperforms the odds is a nice piece of work.

Chris S said:
The trade signalling is based on determining high probability turning points using non-linear functions. That’s really as far as I can go on the signalling. The ability to know when a significant turn is coming is key to the systems success (especially in volatile markets).

So your system works by predicting future market direction and is not just about binaries or binarybet's pricing model?

Incidentally, the binary trading system that I experimented with involved using binaries to hedge futures positions. If I thought the market was trending down, I'd buy "closing up more than 50 or so from where it is now" binaries in a dip and sell the futures on a peak. The binaries protect the futures if the market breaks up out of the channel, and the profit on the futures outweighs the loss on the binaries if it trends down. It's useful for those situations where it tries to break out of the channel and then comes back in as it takes away your fear and keeps you in the trade. Occasionally it breaks the trend before you sell the futures and you get to sell the futures at the binary strike price, locking in a huge profit. It's killed by low volatility though.
 
fat chance said:
Interesting work, I like it.



Can you give some indication of the risk / reward, or by how much your system "outperforms the odds". (If they have a 4-point spread and I buy at 85, maybe around 83% of my trades would be profitable.)


Certain Scenarios like the one you have stated above are quite common especially early on in the day. Depending on the signals generated by our algorythms we can place a trade anywhere between 79 or above and have a 91% probability of success. However the remaining 9% of occasions where the trade goes against you can result in a large loss if you're not around to act on the close signal. (which has happened. In fact whentrading the sys we found ourselves reluctant to move. This is a bit difficult when you're trading the sys from work and are constantly being invited into bloody meetings)

I'd be surprised if binarybet are doing something like this.

All I'm saying is that despite the back engineering of the bin bet pricing model we would occasionally generate prices above 100. Its a guess that Bin bet also get this. I could be wrong and would happily accept that we are wrong on this point.


So your system works by predicting future market direction and is not just about binaries or binarybet's pricing model?

Correct.

We found being able to know the likely direction of the market was absolutely crucial to making any serious money in the binary bet market. Notice the wording here LIKELY. There are no certainties only probabilities. There are two parts to the problem a) direction and b) magnitude. In the version of software just completed we managed to nail direction with a 98% certainty. This enabled us to know in advance of the bin bet pricing model whether the price should start to move. Very often we would get a signal indicating a high probability turn and then 2 - 3 mins later watch as bin bet price began to reflect the change.

We suffered however by not being able to forecast magnitude. We would get a turning signal but knowing whether this was the beginiing of a 5 pt move or 20 pt move proved extremely frustrating and was ultimately what has led us to mothball this application. Its all very well knowing where and when the turn is but if you place a trade and then have to take it off 5 mins later because the extent of the turn was say only 7 or 8 pts you invariably end up taking a small loss. What you really want is a system that identifies high probability turns with high probability magnitudes ie >= 10pts . (10 pts is usually the min and is enough if the index is going from say down 4 to up 6 and one move.)

We think however that we have finally solved the magnitude problem. The solution will be deployed in a more efficient version of the software just completed.

However the application requires a rewrite and more powerful processing capacity. (which we are in the process of building The platform will be made up of 6 linked linux pcs running as a parallel processing unit).
 
Where were you placing bets? Us betfair traders could do with some more liquidity...

That's interesting about the binarybet feed, if you take the "&Doc=Home" bit off the end you get a nice XML feed too :) (which also has some extra fields such as time updated and the change)
 
jules101 said:
Where were you placing bets? Us betfair traders could do with some more liquidity...

That's interesting about the binarybet feed, if you take the "&Doc=Home" bit off the end you get a nice XML feed too :) (which also has some extra fields such as time updated and the change)

Binarybet.com
 
jules101 said:
Where were you placing bets? Us betfair traders could do with some more liquidity...

That's interesting about the binarybet feed, if you take the "&Doc=Home" bit off the end you get a nice XML feed too :) (which also has some extra fields such as time updated and the change)

bear in mind its likely they will close this link. Now its out. I can imagine hundreds of people trying to extract price data from there web site is gonna really annoy them ;)
 
Chris S - Great input on this thread mate. I've been working on a number of systems for BB'ing but you seem light years ahead. That aside I have made a fair bit from BB's although now I tend to find that my accounts have been restricted. The figures you quote sound good but one imagines that if you had made that kind of money then you might find yourself in a similar boat.

With regard to the theories and methodology. I would agree with most if not all you have pointed out in your posts so far. You seriously know your stuff. The most important bit is certainly the correct interpretation of the current trend. If you can get that bit right then the percentage of profitable trades goes through the roof. Secondly I would suggest is the volatility factor. This is the part which the companies find hardest I'd suggest. This is also the part where your strategy can fall apart if you dont factor in certain events.

In my mind I have 3 very basic strategies to start from....

1) A strategy which simply milks the time premium out of a quite sideways market.

2) A strategy which waits for sudden and unpredictable volatility to occur which can not be priced into a company's model in advance. This causes the quotes to move to the extremes of the range (ie <10 or >90) and offers cheap entries into positions where the remaining time premium is vastly underpriced given the sudden short term volatility spike. Yesterdays plane fiasco was a perfect example

3) A strategy which trades as many hours as possible and simply looks to follow the prevailing trend where winners are run to the expiry and obvious losers are cut before they expire against you. We have found that things like big disparities in Advancers / Decliners are great indicators in predicting trends in the Dow for example.

Any views?

On the face of it I am absolutely convinced that it is possible to make a continuous income flow from these bets. I guess it is a case of not being too greedy!

Steve.
 
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stevespray said:
Chris S - Great input on this thread mate. I've been working on a number of systems for BB'ing but you seem light years ahead. That aside I have made a fair bit from BB's although now I tend to find that my accounts have been restricted. The figures you quote sound good but one imagines that if you had made that kind of money then you might find yourself in a similar boat.

You're probably correct. Had I followed the trading signals I may well haev come across some sort of restriction. However we had a strategy for dealing with this type of scenario namely open accounts in several names across several different platforms which would help mitigate some of the difficulties.


stevespray said:
In my mind I have 3 very basic strategies to start from....

1) A strategy which simply milks the time premium out of a quite sideways market.

2) A strategy which waits for sudden and unpredictable volatility to occur which can not be priced into a company's model in advance. This causes the quotes to move to the extremes of the range (ie <10 or >90) and offers cheap entries into positions where the remaining time premium is vastly underpriced given the sudden short term volatility spike. Yesterdays plane fiasco was a perfect example

3) A strategy which trades as many hours as possible and simply looks to follow the prevailing trend where winners are run to the expiry and obvious losers are cut before they expire against you. We have found that things like big disparities in Advancers / Decliners are great indicators in predicting trends in the Dow for example.

Any views?

Taking pt 1

When developing the pricing model we find that the time weighting is neutral around the middle of the trading day. In the early morning time has less weighting than the movement of the index. Time has a greater weighting towards the end of the day but can be overridden by the index weighting where the index oscillates between up and down ie +0.8 - 0.6 within the last few ticks of trading. We havn't looked at sideways pricing there didn't appear to be opportunities that we could reliably and with a high degree of probability(over the long term and in the simulated and real data testing) trade.

Pt 2
We agree.
I'm assuming you are referring to spikes. We initially found these to be a pain that we tended to use to close out positions. However in the new version we are looking at these being markers that act as indicators that signal a resetting of market confidence. We feel that there are very good opportunities in this area and we will be developing this field in the next application.

pt3
Sounds like you are placing multiple trades maybe using a hedging strategy? Our methodology and experience has been in getting one aspect of the application right. Namely identyfing a single trading opportunity. Determining the probability of success and either holding until market close (in which case taking the full difference between purchase price and close ie 100), taking an early profit , closing and taking a small loss or not trading at all. We don't look at any indicators such as advance decline stochastics etc. Our tools are non linear functions that are based directly on the index, index behaviour time etc.

stevespray said:
On the face of it I am absolutely convinced that it is possible to make a continuous income flow from these bets.


I agree.
 
Chris S said:
pt3
Sounds like you are placing multiple trades maybe using a hedging strategy? Our methodology and experience has been in getting one aspect of the application right. Namely identyfing a single trading opportunity. Determining the probability of success and either holding until market close (in which case taking the full difference between purchase price and close ie 100), taking an early profit , closing and taking a small loss or not trading at all. We don't look at any indicators such as advance decline stochastics etc. Our tools are non linear functions that are based directly on the index, index behaviour time etc.

I was talking really in terms of a 'singe trading opportunity' as well. The idea being to maximise gains whilst controlling losses. My theory on this subject is one where I feel I can save myself, on average, more than the cost of entering / exiting the bets.

For example, lets say the spread is 4 points.....

If the market is bang on the strike the price is 48/52. Lets assume trend is up. If I buy 52 I am giving away 2 points as I am in effect paying 52 for a position technically worth 50. I am therefore, at that moment, down 2 points. Obviously if the bet goes on an expires at 100 I will make 48 points but, in effect, I am still down the 2 points in respect of the larger law of averages. If however the bet went against me and we started to fall I am not worried about the loss is the same way that I was not overjoyed at the win. What I am now worried about is making a decision regarding the open position. If I close it before it is worthless (so say around 10 points) and the bet would have gone on to lose then I am up 8 points overall (The 10 points saved minus the 2 point entry cost). I hope you can see my logic here? The logic here is about mitigating the losses in as many of the losing bets as possible. I dont mean cutting them when they go 10 points against you. I'm only interested in saving prehaps 7 or 8 points on most of the losing bets. Quite often this is very easy to do especially on ftse as you can simply look across multipul markets for clues on very short term trend. The idea is to deny the spreadbetting company the maximum payout by saving odd points here and there. Of course you run winners to the close. I've actually had some really nice runs playing this way. On one day I did actually have 8 winners and no losses.

Steve.
 
Chris S you make some very interesting points here & I applaud you for being so open about everything.

I will contribute a little real world trading scenario info here:

For almost 2 years I have been trading on & off with binarybet.com using some of the methods mentioned on this thread (which BTW I just derived from a common sense approach, observing the markets & trading platforms for weeks on end then back testing certain theories with my own hard earned cash). Even with some massive losses caused by overtrading/greed & stupidity I still managed to bank a high 5 figure sum. My paper results when I just observed were astronomical and millionaire making. When you use real money the results differ greatly.

Last year I stood to make £20K on a single day's binarybets. Because of the way the mind works I instead took a -£15K hit as @ that moment in time it was looking like the -£15K would become -£25K. I manually altered my original trading strategy and lost because of it. If I had just not bothered looking @ the markets for a few hours would have been £20K better off instead of -£15K down (which I made back the next week) but the damage has now been done as eversince my trading has become erratic because of this & several other instances where I have second guessed my original trade & lost heavily as a direct result.

I guarantee you that no system or approach can ever hope to continually overcome the way financial markets like to play out unlogicial scenarios. I have worked for global investment banks who have very complex/expensive systems similar to what you developed but even with the massive resources employed to create/maintain them they still cannot get over the need for manual intervention by experienced traders.

Real world trading with your own cash creates complex & unlimited scenarios which you cannot ever hope to simulate.

That does not mean you cannot ever prosper with binaries because you can but it requires a lot of dedication & manual human intervention because of the nature of the extreme binary delta movements which are your best chance of profits as they create good opportunities for each direction/scenario.

Even with my heavy losses I still have a 73% success rate and if I remove several tiny back test deliberate loss trades that rises to almost 85%. Sorry but I just cannot see any system getting better results than this as a lot of success @ binaries is down to human intervention @ the right moment.
 
stevespray said:
I was talking really in terms of a 'singe trading opportunity' as well. The idea being to maximise gains whilst controlling losses. My theory on this subject is one where I feel I can save myself, on average, more than the cost of entering / exiting the bets.

For example, lets say the spread is 4 points.....

What I am now worried about is making a decision regarding the open position. If I close it before it is worthless (so say around 10 points) and the bet would have gone on to lose then I am up 8 points overall (The 10 points saved minus the 2 point entry cost). I hope you can see my logic here? Steve.

Rather 8pts less of a loss than would have occurred had you allowed the position t expire.

stevespray said:
The logic here is about mitigating the losses in as many of the losing bets as possible.

I dont mean cutting them when they go 10 points against you. I'm only interested in saving prehaps 7 or 8 points on most of the losing bets. Quite often this is very easy to do especially on ftse as you can simply look across multipul markets for clues on very short term trend.

Steve.

hmm I understand.

However by being able to determine direction you can employ a strategy that can actually improve on that scenario so rather than as in your example closing out at 10 you could close out at much higher price of say 20 +.

The objective of getting a handle on magnitude would improve on this significantly. Although you can only forecast magnitude with a certain probability.
 
Greed Is Good said:
Chris S you make some very interesting points here & I applaud you for being so open about everything.

I will contribute a little real world trading scenario info here:

I guarantee you that no system or approach can ever hope to continually overcome the way financial markets like to play out unlogicial scenarios. I have worked for global investment banks who have very complex/expensive systems similar to what you developed but even with the massive resources employed to create/maintain them they still cannot get over the need for manual intervention by experienced traders.

Agreed. Losses are part the system. The key is keeping them as low as possible.

Greed Is Good said:
Real world trading with your own cash creates complex & unlimited scenarios which you cannot ever hope to simulate.

hmmmm Our model of the FTSE can produce some fairly crazy scenarios depending on how much volatility you want to introduce.

I do think however that the physcological stresses of obeying an autonomus system combined with the fact that your account is indicating large losses is a real dilema for traders generally and if you mean that a back testing or simulated trading platform cannot and never will induce the "fear " of trading then I agree.

Greed Is Good said:
Even with my heavy losses I still have a 73% success rate and if I remove several tiny back test deliberate loss trades that rises to almost 85%. Sorry but I just cannot see any system getting better results than this as a lot of success @ binaries is down to human intervention @ the right moment.


hmm thats an interesting assessment and pretty much reflects our current performance. Our early testing of the new system is indicating that getting a handle on the magnitude of the move could raise the probability of success into the high 80's (early testing is coming out at circa 86%+) However its the impact on the volatile sessions that is most impressive. Failure by the index to move by the expected magnitude is acting as a reliable indicator in terms of notifying us to close out any trade early. This is having a massive impact on the size of losses across the board. Both in terms of a) protecting us from putting on a trade that has a low probability of a certain sized movement and b) In helping to identify false spike/breakouts.

The second scenario is what I was referring to in an earlier post when I said this is a very interesting area and represents significant opportunities.
 
Greed Is Good - Those are also impressive results..... any chance you want to outline your methodology? (or at least your theory?) Those must be pretty large positions that you are playing with. I'm not surprised you find it stressful if your trading can result in a swing of £45,000 in one trade! I'll stick to my 50p per point!

Chris - I have to say that I am very interested in you comments regarding the magnitude of a move. You really think that it is possible to forecast this before a move? What kind of probabilities are we talking about here?

Obviously a high percentage probability forecast on direction combined with a system which predicts magnitude to any degree of success would be an edge which is formidable in nature.

You mentioned volatility several times. One could argue that unpriced volatility in the companies pricing model is self evident. If the company's quote moves below say 15 in the first 15 mins of the hour then the chances are that the volatility is under priced ie they weren't expecting such volatility. It would be interesting to back test a buy on any hour where either the up or down bet went below 15 in the first 15 to 20 mins. Seeing as its an under priced IV theory the exit would be at the 50/50.

Steve.
 
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